The Real Yorkshire Ripper (Noel O'Gara)

** This is an archived, static copy of the Casebook messages boards dating from 1998 to 2003. These threads cannot be replied to here. If you want to participate in our current forums please go to https://forum.casebook.org **

The Real Yorkshire Ripper (Noel O'Gara)

Casebook Message Boards: Ripper Media: General Discussion: The Real Yorkshire Ripper (Noel O'Gara)

Author: ChrisGeorge Sunday, 23 January 2000 - 02:05 pm
Hi, all: Persons interested in the 1888 Ripper case and the more recent Yorkshire Ripper case may be interested in this new book. There is more about the book at http://www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/ from which I quote the following: "Peter Sutcliffe was the Copy-Cat Ripper, responsible for only four of the thirteen murders which he "confessed" to. He had been eliminated twelve times by the police because he was blood group O: the Ripper was known to be blood group B. The police knew that two men were involved in the bizarre series of murders, but tactical blunders made it expedient to make a deal with the Copy-Cat killer, who was offered ten years in a luxury mental home for his "confessions" to everything, by a police force desperate to close the file. Eighteen years on, the Real Ripper, far from being a hoaxer, and who wrote mockingly to the police in order to implicate the Copy-Cat, is still free in the U.K." The author apparently worked for the man he alleges was the real Yorkshire Ripper. "This 274 page book, not available in the shops, was written by Noel O'Gara, the former employer of the Real Yorkshire Ripper. O'Gara had an insight into the Ripper investigation from none other than the Ripper himself. "This insight has enabled him to piece together the police handling of the investigation and their framing of the mentally disturbed Sutcliffe, who was in fact merely a copy-cat killer responsible for only four of the murders." The URL above includes some message boards. One of the posters on the boards is Patrick Lavelle, author of the recent Wearside Jack who posted that "During my research many Ripper Squad officers, in Northumbria, West Yorkshire and Greater Manchester, told me they believed the hoaxer [who sent the Yorkshire Ripper letter and tape and may himself have been a killer] was a disgruntled police officer." Lavelle alleges a police cover-up. Not much different from the allegations about the 1888 case is it? Chris George
Author: Guy Hatton Monday, 24 January 2000 - 05:33 am
Hi Chris! I read the extracts from O'Gara's book on the Web a while ago, but came to the conclusion that his "theory" holds about as much water as the Maybrick rubbish, and is likely, due to its comparatively high profile, to be almost as damaging to a proper understanding of the case. It appears to be based on little more than hearsay, false information, and a seemingly intense personal dislike of the person he has decided to frame as the "real" Ripper. For instance, the blood group question. O'Gara is completely wrong to ascribe blood group O to Sutcliffe. In fact, Sutcliffe is a non-secretor of the blood group B. The distinction between him and the hoaxer is that the letter-and-tape-sender is/was a secretor of group B. (Which is how the police were able to determine his blood group from saliva on one of the envelopes.) Interestingly, the killer of Joan Harrison ("remember Preston '75") is/was also a B secretor. Unfortunately for O'Gara, basic forensic evidence shows his premise of Sutcliffe as copycat to be fatally flawed. The trail of evidence leading to Sutcliffe, including the size-7 bootprints found on the body of Irene Richardson and on a sheet in Tina Atkinson's flat, and also the distinctive tyre tracks found at the Soldiers Field murder site, starts well before the point at which O'Gara alleges Sutcliffe began his copycat spree. Also, it appears (if I have understood O'Gara's ramblings correctly), his suspect, Billy Tracey, an Irishman, was able accurately to mimic the accent of the small, tightly-knit community of Castletown near Sunderland when recording the "Ripper tape". Just like Maybrick and his varying handwriting, perhaps Tracey also suffers from Multiple Personality Disorder? All in all, not a promising start. Over here in Britain, ITV are showing a new 4-hour docu-drama This Is Personal - The Hunt for the Yorkshire Ripper starting this coming Wednesday. Apparently, it focuses on Assistant Chief Constable George Oldfield rather than Sutcliffe, and it'll be interesting to see how many punches are (or are not) pulled. All the Best Guy
Author: Guy Hatton Monday, 24 January 2000 - 05:51 am
Incidentally, the Message board at yorkshireripper.co.uk has an interesting Y2K bug. It thinks the year is 19100!
Author: Guy Hatton Tuesday, 25 January 2000 - 06:54 am
CORRECTION: In my previous post, for Irene Richardson, read Emily Jackson.(I must not write from memory I must not write from memory I must not write from memory I must not write from memory etc.) Mr. Lavelle's comments on the site are interesting. He refers to footprints, but only in relation to those at the Harrison and Whittaker crime scenes. Others "may" have been found, he says. No, Mr. Lavelle, others WERE found. Why try to play them down? Sutcliffe is claimed to take a size 9 shoe, not a size 7. I can find no corroboration on this point. It has been suggested elsewhere, though, that a size 7 Wellington boot could be worn comfortably by a man with size 8 or 9 feet. I myself usually take a size 9, but am currently wearing "size 8" boots in perfect comfort. Shoe sizes, like clothing sizes, are subject to inconsistencies and variation. Furthermore, the pattern of wear on the sole of one of the boots is said to have indicated someone who was regularly operating some sort of pedal - more suggestive of Sutcliffe the lorry driver than of Tracey. All the Best Guy
Author: ChrisGeorge Tuesday, 25 January 2000 - 11:25 pm
Hi, Guy: I make no special case for Noel O'Gara's suspect -- in fact, I agree that his case against Tracey seems contrived. I am though intrigued by the line of thinking of Patrick Lavelle in "Wearside Jack" that the tape/letter hoaxer (and possible killer) in the Yorkshire Ripper case has gone unapprehended. Chris George
Author: Caz Wednesday, 26 January 2000 - 04:00 am
Yeah, I'd like to know what happened about the investigation into Joan Harrison's murder, where the killer was a B secretor like the hoaxer. Did the police just give up on tracing the hoaxer when they got hold of Sutcliffe? The hoaxer could have turned out to be as dangerous as the Yorkshire ripper himself. Caz
Author: Guy Hatton Wednesday, 26 January 2000 - 06:34 am
Hello Chris and Caz - I agree - it would seem that, once Sutcliffe had been arrested, and had given his confession, the hunt for the author of the letters and tape was abandoned. They were simply dismissed as a timewasting hoax. If that is the case, it is particularly disturbing, given, as Caz seems to be suggesting, the possible real link between the hoaxer and the killing of Joan Harrison. Obviously, the Harrison case does not fall within the jurisdiction of the West Yorkshire Police, but I'm sure that anyone who watched the recent documentary on the Yorkshire Ripper will have been disturbed by Dick Holland's apparently persistent complacency on the issue of the mistakes made in relation to the hoaxer and other issues. He still seemed genuinely shocked the he, Oldfield and others had their arses firmly kicked (in career terms), and yet three murders and a number of other attacks happened while they led the investigation on a wild goose chase, against the advice of the Northumbria Police, their own linguistic experts, and other officers, such as Andrew Laptew. Chris - don't misunderstand me, I realise you were not pleading O'Gara's case! Books about the Yorkshire Ripper are comparatively hard to come by these days - Gordon Burns' Somebody's Husband, Somebody's Son and David Yallop's Deliver Us From Evil have both so far eluded me, though I was able to order Roger Cross' The Yorkshire Ripper from Amazon.co.uk. Imagine the likely confusion that would ensue if the novice "Ripperologist" had only the A to Z and The Diary of Jack the Ripper from which to assess the innocence or guilt of a particular suspect! I simply worry that O'Gara may spark a bout of Yorkshire Ripper mythology that serious students could probably do without. All the Best Guy
Author: judith stock Thursday, 27 January 2000 - 03:43 am
Dear Guy, There are very good copies of the Ripper titles you seek available at www.bookfinder.com --it's a search engine that covers all the used book networks. You should be able to find those books with little hassle. Good hunting...... Regards, Judy
Author: Guy Hatton Tuesday, 31 October 2000 - 06:52 am
I reproduce below my my recent post (and the one preceding it by Keith Brannen) to the message board at Noel O'Gara's "Real Yorkshire Ripper" website as a caution to anyone considering visiting this site. O'Gara not only proposes an untenable "theory" of the Yorkshire Ripper case, it seems he is also prepared to use underhand methods to deflect criticism and correction. As I post this, the original is still on O'Gara's board, but it remains to be seen how long it will survive. Posted ByGuy Hatton on October 31, 19100 at 04:09:20: In Reply to: Noel O'Gara: Post Forger posted byKeith Brannen on October 30, 19100 at 22:11:23: : : My original post on the thread "keith brannen" contained text and : a link to my website under the title "The Yorkshire Ripper Website". : Earlier today, I was informed that the link and title had been changed : to now link to Noel's site and had the title:"The REAL Yorkshire Ripper : Website". : : I did not authorise the changes to my post, and, therefore, the changes : done to it are an out and out forgery. : : The original post was at October 27, 19100 at 21:59:58 : : The "source information" of the file reveals when the forgery was committed: : Location: http://www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/wwwboard/messages/100.html : File MIME Type: text/html : Source: Currently in disk cache : Local cache file: MVIBG644.HTM : Last Modified: Friday, October 27, 2000 22:37:39 Local time : Last Modified: Saturday, October 28, 2000 2:37:39 GMT : : Thirty-eight minutes after I had posted it, my post had been modified. : No one else but Noel, or his webmaster (if he has one) under his direction, : could have made the modification to the file and uploaded it back to the : website. Therefore, Noel (or his webmaster) downloaded the html file, and : committed forgery by removing the URL of my website and replacing it with : his own. : Noel has a habit of deleting files he doesn't like. He did it to Harry : Palmer, and he has done it to me. Back in July of this year, Noel claimed : that a "hacker" had attacked the site. Posts after July 13 were lost, but : all others between 60.htm to 235.htm were loaded back to the website. : However, one whole thread "Beginnings of a website" (where I announced I : was starting a website) was now no longer on the message board and the five : posts from it were missing: (205.htm, 207.htm, 208.htm, 209.htm, 210.htm). : Was it the supposed hacker? No. It was Noel (or a webmaster under his : direction) who deleted those files from the website. The proof is from the : ftp transfer log back to the website: : http://www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/wwwboard/messages/WS_FTP.LOG : Part of ftp log shows the files were re-loaded to the website after the : supposed hacker attack, and yet they have "magically" disappeared. Noel : (or a webmaster under his direction) deleted them. Here is the relevant : section of the ftp log: : 2000.07.25 18:01 B C:\ripper\wwwboard\messages\205.html --> www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/wwwboard/messages 205.html : 2000.07.25 18:01 B C:\ripper\wwwboard\messages\206.html --> www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/wwwboard/messages 206.html : 2000.07.25 18:01 B C:\ripper\wwwboard\messages\207.html --> www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/wwwboard/messages 207.html : 2000.07.25 18:01 B C:\ripper\wwwboard\messages\208.html --> www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/wwwboard/messages 208.html : 2000.07.25 18:01 B C:\ripper\wwwboard\messages\209.html --> www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/wwwboard/messages 209.html : 2000.07.25 18:01 B C:\ripper\wwwboard\messages\210.html --> www.yorkshireripper.co.uk/wwwboard/messages 210.html : It was after this flagrant deletion that I decided to use the optional : URL link to link to my website when I made a post. And for those who : have not been to my website, I have always had a link to Noel's website : on my main page. Yet, for some reason, he deletes posts and forges his : website URL over mine in one of my posts. : So now Noel has shown his lack of any integrity whatsoever. It really shows : the lengths he will go to perpetuate his theory. I have consistently pointed : out his evasionary tactics, his ignoring of facts, his fabrications, etc. : Now we know he will even stoop to forgery. : What a truly pathetic, disgusting, little man you are, Noel. : : The Yorkshire Ripper Website: : http://www.execulink.com/~kbrannen/index.htm As the person who alerted Keith to the doctoring of his post, I wish to add my voice to the protest at Mr. O'Gara's dishonesty. As has been said before, his standards of truthfulness, honesty and integrity in dealing with facts and evidence are lamentable. It has also previously been suggested that "difficult" questions have been deleted rather than addressed, and now it seems that Mr. O'Gara has sunk to gutter level with out-and-out forgery. It is unfortunate for him that he is not clever enough to avoid exposure as a fraud. Please bear all of this in mind when deciding whether his "theories" have any credibility.
Author: Guy Hatton Tuesday, 31 October 2000 - 10:18 am
...and some more: Posted ByGuy Hatton on October 31, 19100 at 10:07:45: In Reply to: Re: Noel O'Gara: Post Forger posted bynoel o' gara on October 31, 19100 at 08:30:36: As a matter of fact, Noel, Keith Brannen does help you by linking to your site, even though he does not agree with you. The only negative mind set on display here is yours - you simply cannot take criticism or correction, and respond in a clearly fascistic manner when anybody has the temerity to put an alternative viewpoint. Even if your theories, arguments and statements could be supported by verifiable fact, your actions towards others would be totally reprehensible. If you would like to see how an internet site can maintain its integrity while still providing links to its opponents, I suggest you visit www.nizkor.org. It is notable that while Nizkor gives visitors links to the material which is being criticised, thus allowing them to make their own judgements, the assorted Nazis, anti-Semites and Holocaust deniers in question refuse reciprocal links. Sound familiar? So which of these sets of people would you most like to resemble, eh? I sincerely hope that Keith, despite your atrocious behaviour, will continue to provide a link to your site. I would not blame him, though, if he were to issue a much more severe warning about its content than he presently does. : Keith , If my site is such unimportant crap and lies etc , why dont you go away and devote your considerable brain to something more important. : My webmaster , on my instructions took your links off my site because of your negative mind set.Why would I help a person such as you to promote your site ? Do you help me ?If you call that forgery thats fine . You have a way with words and interpreting facts.

Add a Message