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** This is an archived, static copy of the Casebook messages boards dating from 1998 to 2003. These threads cannot be replied to here. If you want to participate in our current forums please go to https://forum.casebook.org **
After Jack
Casebook Message Boards: Ripper Suspects: Ripper Suspects:
After Jack
Author: Howard Brown
Thursday, 29 August 2002 - 07:18 pm |        | | Dear Posters...What changes did the Ripper case make,if any,regarding the way police handled subsequent cases in Britain? If any,does anyone know what they were ? |
Author: Ashleah Skinner
Thursday, 29 August 2002 - 07:31 pm | | Hi Howard,
well after Mary J Kelly's murder Queen Victoria promptly telegramed the Cabinet for "some very decided action" she went on saying "all the courts must be lit and our police improved" and after that ALL courts got stricter and police procedures were looked at and improved. Hope this helps |
Author: Howard Brown
Thursday, 29 August 2002 - 09:34 pm | | | Thanks Ashleah. Considering that the forensic improvement( such as fingerprinting ) did not unfold until later, how did the police methodology change for the better? This might be a question better suited for a police expert like Mr. Evans or Mr.Medine. I know that here in Philadelphia,until recently,the "Philly Lie Detector" was employed on suspects of crimes with great success. The suspect is handcuffed,behind the back,tossed into a paddy wagon( police van,f.y.i.),and then driven around a secluded spot,at great speed,bouncing all over the back of the van helplessly,as the cops sped up,then applied the brakes,repeatedly. Likewise,the infamous "Philly Phone Book" was employed. The suspect was handcuffed,seated,and had a Philadelphia phone book( back then they were very thick phone books ) placed on his head. Then a cop would take a sledge hammer( 5 lb.) and smash the phonebook while atop the suspect. This obviously jars the gray matter a little,but leaves no bruises...Under Frank Rizzo and during the 1960's race riots in the US,these tactics were common practice in Philly.... Needless to say,some tree-hugging do-gooders whined enough to get these two practices banned from utilization......but seriously,did British police have greater freedom to search homes,implement curfews,things like that......Thanks |
Author: Martin Fido
Friday, 30 August 2002 - 05:12 am | | The best known immediate change, Howard, was a standing order that Met officers who found dead or injured assault victims on the street were to stay with them until assistance (whistled up) arrived, and keep the crime site from being cleaned up immediately as had happened in Polly Nichols' case. This resulted in PC Ernest Thompson (240H) staying with the dying Frances Coles under the Swallow Gardens railway arches, even though he could hear foorsteps running away which, for the rest of his life, he believed must have been the Ripper escaping.
All the best,
Martin F |
Author: Scott E. Medine
Friday, 30 August 2002 - 10:00 am | | Howard,
As far as police procedures in the UK are concerned, Stewart Evans will be a better source of information than I am. However, I do know that Melville McNaughten was one of the leading factors behind making fingerprinting a leading form of criminal and personal identification. He felt that the had finger printing been employed at the time of the Ripper murders then the killer could have been caught. Whether or not I agree with that....let's just say that if a frog had wings he wouldn't bump his a$$ everytime he hopped.
As far as the police tactics you mentioned, next time you watch "Cops" pay strict attention as to whether the officers buckle the seat belt on the person in the back seat. If they don't, chances are he or she is a problem and they are on their way to receiving their "Hollywood Screen Test."
Peace,
Scott |
Author: Divia deBrevier
Friday, 30 August 2002 - 11:28 am | | Good to see you back on the boards, Scott!
Warm regards,
Divia |
Author: Monty
Friday, 30 August 2002 - 12:23 pm | | Hello all,
I thought that the use of photography at the crime scene (thinking of Kelly) was developed during this case.
Am I wrong again ????
Monty
PS Scott, how go it ? I wont bug you about you know what but Im bloody interested ! |
Author: Scott E. Medine
Friday, 30 August 2002 - 01:39 pm | | Thanks Diva and Monty.
Monty I have yet to hear from Mr. Barrett.
Peace,
Scott |
Author: Howard Brown
Friday, 30 August 2002 - 04:05 pm | | | Thanks Mr.Fido,for that reply. I'm trying to imagine the frustration of officer Thompson at that scenario.On all levels for him,a totally agonizing situation Thank you,Scott,for reminding me of the Hollywood Screen Test..... |
Author: Martin Fido
Saturday, 31 August 2002 - 07:06 am | | Hi Howard!
The committee on which Macnaghten sat in 1893-4 (the Troup Committee) recommended that the Bertillon method of recording body-part measurements (anthropometry) should be routinely used for criminal records and as a means of identification, with fingerprints added to the Bertillon card for information. The fingerprints were not in themselves of much use, however, unless you had your previously-offending suspect in front of you, arrested on other grounds, and could then check his prints against those on his alphabetically stored card. For nobody had any way of cataloguing and recovering them. This was finally devised (in India) by Edward Henry, who happened to be in England in 1900 when the Belper Committee sat to reconsider Bertillonism and fingerprinting, and gave absolutely convincing evidence of the value of properly classified and catalogued retrievable fingerprints. The Belper Committee recommended their use, and in 1901 Henry succeeded Robert Anderson as Assistant Commissioner (C) at Scotland Yard, and founded the Fingerprint Bureau. In 1903 when Commissioner Bradshaw retired, Henry succeeded him, and Macnaghten moved into the Assistant Commissioner's place. |
Author: Howard Brown
Saturday, 31 August 2002 - 08:26 am | | | Once again,Mr.Fido,I thank you for this information...on a more important note,how are you coming along after your surgery? Great,I hope. Howard |
Author: Martin Fido
Saturday, 31 August 2002 - 09:13 am | | As they predicted, Howard, a feeling like sitting on a golf ball when I cough, sneeze, or sit down suddenly. Otherwise, right as rain. And many thanks for the inquiry.
All the best,
Martin F |
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