Author: Monty
Monday, 20 January 2003 - 11:47 am |        |
Folks,
A quick question or two.
Jacks knife, the one held by Mr Rumbelow, is said to have been on display and in many illustrations.
Well, I cant find them anywhere. Can someone point me in the right direction please ? Most kind.
Secondly, the said knife...an amputating knife. Would or could it have commited the damage to the victims ? Does have to match them all, I'll take any. I know the history, I just want your thoughts.
Obviously I understand that these are just you're opinions....so no squabbling
Monty
 |
Author: chris scott
Monday, 20 January 2003 - 11:52 am | |
There is an illustration of what I believe is the knife you're talking about in the Dan Farson book. Let me know if you dont have access to this and I'll try and get it scanned
Chris S |
Author: Scott E. Medine
Monday, 20 January 2003 - 03:02 pm | |
Chris if you can scan it I would be obliged. i have a civil war amputating knife. It has a serated edge and was made by a company in Ohio. It is rather samll, measuring 8 inches in length and an inch and a half wide. It is rather flimsy, and this is based on how strudy I would think an amputaitng knife should be. The knife is also missing it's handle.
On a recent to Vicksburg, I spoke with a Civil War Historian about the knife. He stated that many doctors and medics may have had items such as the amputating knife made specifically for them as the Army could not afford to equip everyone. He also stated, in the later years of the war, it would have been common for doctors or medical personnel to be required to furnish their own supplies and some of the supplies used were rather crude.
Peace,
Scott |
Author: Tony Rutherford
Monday, 20 January 2003 - 03:27 pm | |
Monty,
I think this is the knife you're referring to:  |
Author: Tony Rutherford
Monday, 20 January 2003 - 03:33 pm | |
Monty,
The picture's in Don Rumbelow's hardback edition of The Complete Jack the Ripper, 1987. I hope it's of help
Tony |
Author: stephen stanley
Monday, 20 January 2003 - 04:44 pm | |
You're going to think this is very sick...reading all the above, I dashed off to my Re-enactment weaponry cupboard..out came the sword, the bayonet..ah!! there it was..the Dirk..seems very similiar in size to the above knife..so,yes I tried to work out how practical it would have been for Jack's M.O....first,Quite difficult to conceal.
Secondly,(now we start getting messy)..whilst O.K. for throat-cutting, any other work would be pure butchery(no problem there?)
Finally...as someone mentioned on another thread..yes, edged weapons must be wiped/cleaned ASAP..or your get a rusty lump of metal very quickly...& we're not just talking about after use...the damp air..fingermarks..you need to carry an "oily rag" at all times.
There we go ..first application of "experimental history" to JTR??
Steve |
Author: chris scott
Monday, 20 January 2003 - 05:24 pm | |
Thats definitely the same one as in the pic I have
Thanks Tony
:-)
Chris |
Author: Jesse Flowers
Tuesday, 21 January 2003 - 10:00 am | |
Monty-
Regarding your question as to whether Mr. Rumbelow's knife could conceivably have been used in any of the homicides...
Dr. Phillips did, I believe, state at the Chapman inquest that a post-mortem knife (like the one in question) could have been the murder weapon. In any case, IIRC he felt that the weapon would have had a thin, narrow blade and been at least 6 to 8 inches long. The photo in Mr. Rumbelow's book appears to be of just such a knife. No doubt many thousands of other knives could answer to the same description, but there it is.
AAA88 |
Author: John W. Whitaker
Tuesday, 21 January 2003 - 01:13 pm | |
| Could a knife, like the one pictured above, have been used to cause Martha Tabram's "bayonette" wound? |
Author: Michael Raney
Tuesday, 21 January 2003 - 01:54 pm | |
Monty,
IMO, yes that knife could have been used to make the wounds.
John,
I believe that knife could have made the "bayonette" wound on Tabram. In my work I have seen reports stating that "The wound was made with a knife at least 6 inches long and one inch wide", as it turned out, this particular wound was made with a fingernail file! (It was not a mortal wound). A lot depends on the angle of the cut, the force behind the blade and wether or not it was "worked" back and forth in the wound. Most medical examiners today, especially so in Victorian times, initially are making educated guesses based on their experience. It is not until later when a forensic team looks at all the evidence that more accurate findings are made. This is all my humble opinion based on my experience working for and with law enforcement.
Mikey |
Author: John W. Whitaker
Tuesday, 21 January 2003 - 05:17 pm | |
Thanks Mike,
I don't really have any background to draw on.
John. |
Author: Monty
Thursday, 23 January 2003 - 11:54 am | |
Gentlemen,
Ive been away for a few days.
Imagine my joy upon my return in finding the above posts. To each one of you I am grateful.
It makes things a little clearer.
It does seen an awkward knife to handle. Would, if it was indeed the knife, it take some getting use to in the handling ? It would seem so to me.
I for one, would feel clumsey with such an article. I'd be drawing it out saying..."hold on there a mo luv....I'd be wiv you in two shakes of.....damn knife !!"" .
Thanks again,
Monty
|
Author: stephen stanley
Thursday, 23 January 2003 - 02:40 pm | |
I think that's the point(ouch!!) I was aiming at, Monty,I would have thought anything over 8"blade length was a little unwieldy for Jack's type of work.
Steve |
Author: Monty
Friday, 24 January 2003 - 11:25 am | |
Stephen,
All right, no need to be so sharp with me.
I agree. Just so awkward...too awkward I reckon.
I cant believe that I knife like that would be so easy to handle as to carve up Eddowes face like that.....but what do I know ?? Very little.
Monty
|
Author: stephen stanley
Friday, 24 January 2003 - 02:37 pm | |
Exactly!!!..I can cope with the "lower work"..but I can't envisage something that big for the delicate bits(Why is this starting to sound like a Carry-On film?)..I do wonder if we're looking at two knives?
Steve |
