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Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2506
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 09, 2005 - 10:59 am: | 
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if the sign says millers its millers, hey if people right miller's then isnt it because they dont know its millers unless the sign writer was a moron, in which case,
who really can ever tell!!
Jenni |
Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2508
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 09, 2005 - 11:15 am: |
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well anyrate the Great Apostrophe Debate really doesnt have a lot to do with this issues Rip now does it.
Though the great Apostrophe Debate could run and run.
umm, really should've tried to get a few more 's in there!!
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Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 531
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, June 09, 2005 - 9:11 pm: |
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Eduardo...
....and foreign is good,E.Z.....its real good.
With that towel on your head,I almost was going to say, "5 dollars on pump 2"...but then I stopped and considered how poorly Adam Wood and the Parlours treated you and damaged your career by casting you in the sterotypical role of swarthy "heavies" and villains. You tell them to stick it and to go get John Rhys-Davies if they want continental shady characters.
Just wait until Montgolfier Bell and I are able to ditch Alan Sharp as our booking agent and we will hook up for that film we were born to make.
HowBrown
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Monty
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Monty
Post Number: 1691
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 4:39 am: |
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How,
I bagsy a youthful SPE whilst you can take on a more mature and worldly Begg in a JtR remake of Butch and Sundance.
Wescott can take on the role of the Bolivian army.....as per usual. He likes uniforms, so Ive heard...if you know what I mean. 
And you can croggy Jane Coram on a bike during my rendition of 'diary tests keep falling on my head.'
I feel a big hit on our hands here !!
Monty
"You got very nice eyes, DeeDee. Never noticed them before. They real?"
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Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2513
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 6:02 am: |
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Monty,
thankfully for me i have no idea what you mean!
certainly something for the rest of us to look forward to this latest idea of yours and How's
Jenni
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Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 538
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 9:27 pm: |
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Montezuma Bell:
The bike ride with Janie sounds nice...You as SPE sounds okay to me...I can get behind the idea of being a faux Begg...
Wescott as a Bolivian? Hmm..He is an army,I'll give you that..
I can visualize a scene in a cantina near LaPaz...having a cup of coffee [ please..no tea.] and a bagel, while rambling on about the pros and cons of the article,while some bewildered Bolivianos scratch their sombreros and say...
"Quien eres este dos hombres locos que hablar mucho de mensaje en la pared de Calle Goulston?"
In English...."Who are those guys?"
I wanna be Sundance. You're smarter.
HowBrown
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Thomas C. Wescott
Inspector
Username: Tom_wescott
Post Number: 376
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 9:33 pm: |
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You people are loopy as hell. Ha ha. What's a Bolivian?
T-Dubs |
Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 540
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 9:56 pm: |
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T.C.
If haven't seen the film Montreal Bell was referring to,then they are people that live in Bolivia.
They wrap up blow in leaves and eat it,as they work.
I've been pushing the idea for our company to start up a plant in Bolivia,based on this wonderful local,indiginous custom. Oh,those Third Worlders ! Make my leaf a big one,Pedro, por favor !
Keep up the smart talk,and you'll find your temporary S.A.G. card revoked. I have pull and can pull it with the best of 'em.
HowBrown
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Thomas C. Wescott
Inspector
Username: Tom_wescott
Post Number: 378
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 11:56 pm: |
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Blow? You mean cocaine? Tell Monty not to forget his pipe.
Tom |
Eduardo Zinna
Detective Sergeant
Username: Eduardo
Post Number: 84
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 7:07 am: |
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Howard,
Ursäkta mig, I thought you didn't know Swedish. Talar ni engelska?
Adjö,
Eduardo |
Glenn G. Lauritz Andersson
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Glenna
Post Number: 3555
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 7:15 am: |
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Eduardo!
Vad är detta? Pratar du svenska också? How many languages have you actually studied?
Vänligen
(Message edited by Glenna on June 11, 2005)
G. Andersson, author/crime historian
Sweden
The Swedes are the men That Will not be Blamed for Nothing
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Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2525
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 7:35 am: |
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Tom,
who exactly are loopy as hell? Nah! Nothing wrong with us.
Jenni |
Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 542
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 1:38 pm: |
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Eduardo...
No, my fellow underpaid stage performer...I don't know Swedish.
Mapplethorpe Bell won't be totin' a pipe in Bolivia, Tom...Alan's cut from his end of the road tour leaves us little money for luxuries. There are other ways to "Go in the snow"....
...sniff..
HowBrown
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David O'Flaherty
Chief Inspector
Username: Oberlin
Post Number: 923
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 1:49 pm: |
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Howard,
Strange you don't speak the language. . .rumor has it that there is a big Swedish influence in some of your performances.
Your buddy,
Dave |
Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 543
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 3:31 pm: |
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Dave O
In what way,babe? As in since I get less of a chunk o' change than Mansfield Bell and our rotten agent Sharp,that I take things in Stride ?
...or that I was turned down,despite having all the mad skills, to play Inspector Abbaline in a off-off-off Broadway play ?
Your pal, How
HowBrown
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Glenn G. Lauritz Andersson
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Glenna
Post Number: 3566
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 3:48 pm: |
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"...that I take things in Stride ?
"...to play Inspector Abbaline"
Oooooh... oooh... 
All the best 
G. Andersson, author/crime historian
Sweden
The Swedes are the men That Will not be Blamed for Nothing
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Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 547
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 4:13 pm: |
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Glenn..
Now you know why,when in the typically tough crowd one encounters in Khazakistan in summer stock this past year while on tour, Alan dropped the curtain,personally,when I tried to improvise some jokes with Mortimer Bell on stage.
HowBrown
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Suzi Hanney
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Suzi
Post Number: 2620
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 5:07 pm: |
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ABBAline !!!!!! NOWyoure talking!!!!!!! Voulez Vous?
At the end of the day.........'Whats the Name of the Game?'
Suzix
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Suzi Hanney
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Suzi
Post Number: 2621
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 5:09 pm: |
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AH ha! ah ha! ah!!!! oops got totally Abba'd!!
Masters of the Scene!!!
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Glenn G. Lauritz Andersson
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Glenna
Post Number: 3571
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 5:39 pm: |
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Mad mad mad. Totally mad.
All the best
G. Andersson, author/crime historian
Sweden
The Swedes are the men That Will not be Blamed for Nothing
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Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4538
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 5:46 pm: |
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Walter Dew, couldn't escape if I wanted to... |
Suzi Hanney
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Suzi
Post Number: 2624
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 5:53 pm: |
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Yep Glenn but.........
'Abba' mad!!
there's mad and MAD hehehehe!
Then of course we could be Bad Bad Bad totally Bad...or Michael Jackson!!!!!!
S.Hanney ,amusing halfwit/ex art teacher/someone who should be in bed rather than typing here
x
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Suzi Hanney
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Suzi
Post Number: 2625
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2005 - 5:55 pm: |
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Ooooooooooooops that should read
-------------------------------------------
S.Hanney .as above
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Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2526
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, June 12, 2005 - 5:38 am: |
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Oh OK Tom,
I see your point
Jenni |
Monty
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Monty
Post Number: 1696
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 4:00 am: |
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Tom,
You see, theres that assumption again. You gotta drop this prejudice !
And when SPE (me) and Begg (How) come bursting out of that 10 Bells door (now mysteriously set in Bolivia) make sure you shoot Brown, the fat older guy with the Village people moustache, first !!
Besides, there more of him to hit than me.
Monty
"You got very nice eyes, DeeDee. Never noticed them before. They real?"
|
Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2540
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 9:35 am: |
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Hey guys,
I don't understand why this is set in Bolivia? Whats the deal?
Jenni
ps Monty I got your message - hope you got the reply! |
Monty
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Monty
Post Number: 1698
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 10:15 am: |
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Oh for fuc....
C'mon Jenn, you telling me you havent seen Butch Begg and the Sundance Evans?
Monty
"You got very nice eyes, DeeDee. Never noticed them before. They real?"
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Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2541
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 10:22 am: |
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And what if I am?!! Whats wrong with that!!
Yeah its what I'm telling you. SO!!
Jenni |
Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2543
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 11:34 am: |
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Monty,
thats not the only classic film i've not seen for your information, oh no, not by a long shot! I haven't seen any of these either!!(all of them classics!)
The Wizard of Oz, Flashdance, Fame, the Sound of Music, A Clockwork Orange, Harry Potter and the Philosphers Stone, Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets, Saturday Night Fever, the Lion King, Grease, Vanilla Sky, Murder By Decree, Psycho, American Psycho, Babe: Pig in The City, Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban, Ocean's 12, Star Wars, Episode Two: Attack of the Clones, Monster, Monsters Inc, Finding Nemo, Shrek, Shrek Two, Clerks, the Excorist, Chitty Chitty Bang Bang, Meet the Parents, Zulu, The Third Man, Saving Private Ryan, Schinderlers List, Rambo, Rambo two, Rambo three, Star Wars Episode Three, whatever its called, New York New York, Independence Day, El Dorado,
Shall i stop now?!!
LOL! So there you go, want to make something of it!!!!!
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Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2547
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 12:29 pm: |
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Thelma and Louise, there's another one, Pretty Woman,
i wonder if there are any films i have seen!! |
Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 572
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, June 13, 2005 - 6:04 pm: |
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Note to self..
... remember the "fat older guy " and "the more of him to hit than me" and " the Village people moustache" comments when its time for him to ditch his horse and jump on mine in our getaway..
...remember to let him sit up in front of the saddle.
>>>> Blog entry for June 13,2006<<<<
HowBrown
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Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2556
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 14, 2005 - 6:42 am: |
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Is no one going to tell me?!
"be just and fear not"
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Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2558
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 14, 2005 - 7:11 am: |
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Tell me, tell me, tell me, don't be swines!!!
"be just and fear not"
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Eduardo Zinna
Detective Sergeant
Username: Eduardo
Post Number: 85
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2005 - 2:36 pm: |
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Jenni,
I can't bear to see a woman suffer. For no good reason, that is.
Paul Newman played Butch Cassidy and Robert Redford played the Sundance Kid in a film called - you guessed it! "Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid", which was made sometime between the Jurassic and the beginning of global warning. I would hazard 1967.
In real life, Butch and the Kid were less than able bank-and-train robbers who, when pursued relentlessly by the Pinkertons, decided to move their operations south of the border - as far south as you could get.
In the movie, they wind up in Bolivia. They face the whole Bolivian army, just the two of them, and as they rush out to confront them pistol in hand, there is a freeze-frame. Credits roll. Music plays. Eyes moist up.
In real life, B and the K went down to Patagonia and raised sheep the rest of their lives.
Hope everything is clear now.
By the way, Howard and Neil, don't hire anybody who pretends to have an authentic Bolivian accent without double-checking with an expert. All the Bolivians in the movie were Mexican. Trust me.
All the best,
Eduardo |
David O'Flaherty
Chief Inspector
Username: Oberlin
Post Number: 935
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2005 - 2:54 pm: |
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Hi Eduardo,
I thought Butch and Sundance left Patagonia and went back to Bolivia (Etta Place disappeared). Didn't they die in San Vicente during a standoff with Bolivian authorities (a smaller number than that shown in the movie)? Instead of going down in a blaze of glory scene depicted in the movie, it's believed that Butch shot a mortally wounded Sundance and then killed himself rather than surrender. Like Jesse James and Billy the Kid, there were rumors that one or both of the men survived (I don't think so).
Check out the movie if you have a chance, Jenni. A classic and very funny.
Dave
|
Eduardo Zinna
Detective Sergeant
Username: Eduardo
Post Number: 86
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2005 - 3:47 pm: |
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Hi Dave,
Yes, you're probably right, but the version I gave was, I thought, more fun. Bruce Chatwin found some evidence for it. In my view, Patagonia is a great stretch of country. I regret not having been back for many years. And all the efforts by the Bolivian Government to find the graves of BC and the SK have so far failed.
There were also some stories in, I believe, the National Geographic, about Butch's sister telling them about his coming home.
At any rate, BC and the SK was not altogether my style. It was OK, but the real ticket was and is "The Wild Bunch".
All the best,
Eduardo
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David O'Flaherty
Chief Inspector
Username: Oberlin
Post Number: 936
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2005 - 4:06 pm: |
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Ha ha, Eduardo. You're right, your version is much more fun. Personally, I'd rather herd sheep in Patagonia than chew a bullet in San Vicente.
I'm not really a Western buff but I highly recommend the novels of Larry McMurtry, particularly Lonesome Dove and Zeke and Ned.
Cheers,
Dave |
Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2566
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2005 - 5:17 pm: |
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Thank you Eduardo,
see someone was willing to tell me!
Jenni
"be just and fear not"
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Thomas C. Wescott
Inspector
Username: Tom_wescott
Post Number: 380
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2005 - 8:12 pm: |
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RANDOM OBSERVATION: People just coming onto this thread will think the latest issue of Rip offers full coverage of 'Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid' along with a history of Bolivia. |
Jennifer D. Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 2568
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 16, 2005 - 4:24 am: |
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Tom,
and who's fault is it!?
Jenni
"be just and fear not"
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Christopher T George
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Chrisg
Post Number: 1556
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 16, 2005 - 6:26 pm: |
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T. C. Wescott wrote--
"RANDOM OBSERVATION: People just coming onto this thread will think the latest issue of Rip offers full coverage of 'Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid' along with a history of Bolivia."
Tom, have you been reading our upcoming contents list???!!!! 
No, er, seriously, you might expect to see something in our pages perhaps about Roslyn D'Onston and the Cricketer's Arms, and Coroner Wynne Baxter -- both linked to the Brighton area where the upcoming UK conference will happen October 7-9. 
All my best
Chris
(Message edited by ChrisG on June 16, 2005)
Christopher T. George
North American Editor
Ripperologist
http://www.ripperologist.info
See "Jack--The Musical" by Chris George & Erik Sitbon
The Drama of Jack the Ripper Weekend
Charlotte, NC, September 16-18, 2005
http://www.actorssceneunseen.com/ripper.asp
|
Thomas C. Wescott
Inspector
Username: Tom_wescott
Post Number: 386
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 16, 2005 - 8:37 pm: |
|
Chris,
Sounds awesome. You know I like to read anything about D'Onston, and I'd love to read a history of Baxter. When you study a case like this for a certain amount of time you feel the urge to learn more about the people you're reading about, even if such information won't lead to the resolution of the BIG mystery. But knowing what made the key players tick sure as hell couldn't hurt. And I think it's nice that we can still care about people who've been dead a hundred years. We should all be so lucky.
Yours truly,
Tom Wescott
P.S. When are you releasing your Musical on DVD? I'd like to get it.
P.S.S. That plug for the conference was totally shameless!!!  |
Natalie Severn
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Severn
Post Number: 2060
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 17, 2005 - 12:25 pm: |
|
Have just finished reading Joe Chetcuti"s feature on Tumblety.
Found all this fascinating Joe!
But I wonder about a few of the conclusions you draw about these characters.
I honestly can"t see Tumblety getting past first base in this voting system to gain entry into one of these elite, very exclusive British clubs!They"d have sniffed him out within the first five minutes in my view.
I also cant see Stead having the clout to support such entry of Tumblety. After all you yourself say that he had upset the establishment to the point where he got himself, as editor of Pall Mall Gazette ,imprisoned for libel for three months etc.
Stead"s revelations about procurers of East End child prostitutes , his exposures of child prostitution,his support for , the then unpopular raising of the age of consent from 13 to 16,all these things were seen as an anathema by the members of such clubs-the article in Vanity Fair
18 december 1886 by Colonel Hughes -Hallett says so.viz".... and likely to have "our unfriends[Germany and France]...to roundly abuse us"---- presumably by lampooning London as the "sin" capital of Europe.
So his attacks not only got him imprisoned but and,you say yourself, earned him many enemies in the establishment.And this same Vanity Fair article by Burtongoes on ,...."the abomination [Stead and his Pall Mall Gazette] "boycotted" by the press, "expelled from clubs", and driven in disgrace "etc.......
Perhaps I am reading you wrong but surely, after being ostracised like this ,Stead simply wouldnt have had the standing to help Tumblety gain entry to anything much, let alone this club?
Also I doubt very much whether Stead would have got on very well with a man like Tumblety.This William Stead seems so full of rectitude and religious zeal to have ever warmed to a con man like Tumblety-Stead such a fervent Methodist preacher using his Pall Mall Gazette to rid the capital of corruption etc ?
I accept Tumblety and Stead both had these Irish Home Rule sympathies but I doubt they saw eyeball to eyeball over much else!
I have meanwhile become "interested" in "Sir Richard Francis Burton" and the cutting short of his military career.Curious.
Endlessly fascinating research and a really great read Joe.A big Thankyou to you and Jeff for unearthing all this
---and you may yet be proved right!
Natal;ie |
Christopher T George
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Chrisg
Post Number: 1557
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 17, 2005 - 2:30 pm: |
|
Hi Natalie
I think the curtailing of Sir Richard Francis Burton's military career is easily explainable-- he had become too interested in foreign adventure and translating exotic Arabian stories, garnering for himself an international reputation as an adventurer and literary man.
Joe Chetcuti's part 2 of "Trailing an Infiltrator" is now being typeset for our July issue, and you can look forward to more revelations and speculation about our favorite Indian herb doctor and his shady dealings.
Thanks for your interest in our magazine and its contents, Natalie.
All my best
Chris
Christopher T. George
North American Editor
Ripperologist
http://www.ripperologist.info
See "Jack--The Musical" by Chris George & Erik Sitbon
The Drama of Jack the Ripper Weekend
Charlotte, NC, September 16-18, 2005
http://www.actorssceneunseen.com/ripper.asp
|
Natalie Severn
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Severn
Post Number: 2061
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 17, 2005 - 4:08 pm: |
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tThanks Chris for the information about Burton.Since I wrote the last post re Joe"s article I have read Howard"s and Neil"s very worthy discussion.
Its a clever and entertainingly written article
pointing out many important factors pertaining to possibly a crucial clue to the identity of the Ripper.
I will think on some of this for a while.
So thanks Howard and Neil for a very interesting and informative read.
I hope you will forgive me for adding a point of my own.In the days when I was a more convinced Druittist I felt that the writing provided us with a clue about the writer"s occupation.I thought that a school teacher might well have a piece of chalk in their pocket.I am a teacher and when I first started I had a difficult time of it trying to write neatly and evenly on a vertical surface but as time went on I learnt how to do it and how to present such writing in a way that didnt draw disapproval from the head-teacher.
So in answer to Neil"s question about who could have crouched in semi darkness to write gibberish in a neat round schoolboy hand I would answer -a school teacher could have!
Again- thanks and a great read!
Natalie
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Christopher T George
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Chrisg
Post Number: 1558
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 17, 2005 - 5:00 pm: |
|
Hi Natalie
Thanks for your compliments about Howard and Neil's contribution. I think a "point - counterpoint" type of format is a dynamic thing for us to publish as well, with two commentators expressing their point of view.
You actually do bring up a very good point about the graffito. Without saying the person who wrote the graffito was the murderer, or that they had to have been a schoolteacher, when you think about it, as you indicate, it is not easy to write in a natural manner on a chalkboard let alone on a brick wall. In fact to write larger than your normal writing is in itself somewhat of an unnatural activity, given also that you are writing at an angle from the words you are trying to write and not directly over the writing as you would be when you write on a piece of paper. This does almost imply that the person who wrote on the wall had to have had practice writing on a surface other than paper, to be able to make the writing look neat, or as Halse stated, written in "a schoolboy's round hand". Good points, Nats.
All my best
Chris
Christopher T. George
North American Editor
Ripperologist
http://www.ripperologist.info
See "Jack--The Musical" by Chris George & Erik Sitbon
The Drama of Jack the Ripper Weekend
Charlotte, NC, September 16-18, 2005
http://www.actorssceneunseen.com/ripper.asp
|
Thomas C. Wescott
Inspector
Username: Tom_wescott
Post Number: 387
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 17, 2005 - 8:45 pm: |
|
Natalie, Chris, and all,
Regarding Joe Chetcuti's piece in the recent Rip, even IF there were a shred of truth to the speculation that Stead invited someone into his club, who was a retired army surgeon, or pretended to be, and this person caused Hallet to suspect him of being the Ripper, why in God's name would Tumblety be the first person we'd suspect? If memory serves, there was another contemporary suspect, who was prone to cause suspicion, who was a retired army surgeon, and who Stead considered "the most remarkable man I've ever met". Of course, this man is Robert Donston Stephenson, a.k.a. Roslyn D'Onston. There's no reason to suggest that Hallet, in the newspaper piece that sparked Chetcuti's article, was actually saying he thought someone at HIS club was the Ripper, but even if that were the case, and there was actualy evidence to suggest this person was connected to Stead (there isn't such evidence), then D'Onston would simply have to be the first logical choice.
Yours truly,
Tom Wescott
P.S. Natalie...you mentioned that Howard's and Neil's piece was 'convincing'. Since they offered two sides of an argument, this begs the question, 'which one did you find MORE convincing?' I'm glad to see someone commenting on the issue this thread is dedicated to, and not Bolivia. |
Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 596
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 17, 2005 - 9:53 pm: |
|
Tom.......
Back up there,homes...
Stead didn't say [ emboldened section].."If memory serves, there was another contemporary suspect, who was prone to cause suspicion, who was a retired army surgeon, and who Stead considered "the most remarkable man I've ever met".
He said, "He is one of the most remarkable men I've ever met.." and you can find that on page 129 of the True Face.
Neil's part of the story was better. Quit rubbing it in or I will make a Double Pinyata out of you and Big Mouth Reineke.
Your pal,the registered one...
How
HowBrown
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Howard Brown
Chief Inspector
Username: Howard
Post Number: 597
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, June 17, 2005 - 10:03 pm: |
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...and in reference to Joe's very good article on Stead and Tumblety...Stephenson was in Brighton in June of that year,leaving there for London Hospital,as you know,sometime from June 25th to July 26th, and then checking in for the balance of the year [ almost] and leaving London Hospital on Dec. 7th, 1888....maybe another date that will live in infamy.
So the way I seize it,Tom...and its just a hunch...Tumblety may fit the bill whereas RDS may not have been able to join the U.S.C,due to his being hospitalized for 139 days. Factor in the fact that he moved to Brighton earlier that year and we are looking at at the outside,a month of that summer,fall,and winter where it could have been RDS.
(Message edited by howard on June 17, 2005)
HowBrown
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Natalie Severn
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Severn
Post Number: 2066
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, June 18, 2005 - 5:06 am: |
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Hi Tom,
In answer to your question about which was the most convincing it was Howards.No real competition for me because and here I must confess that I have always been convinced
that the ripper wrote the graffiti!Don"t seem able to be budged on it.
Its quite right too what How said about Halse being the observer who seemed to have paid most attention to detail-"it looked fresh" -that sealed it for me-if it looked fresh
that morning then the ripper wrote it because chalk only looks "fresh" for a day at the most in my experience!
But as I say above, I think both How and Neil, for whatever reason ,left out an important point in the debate about WHO would have been able to write in cursive writing "in a neat schoolboy hand" on an unyielding vertical surface in the dark.And the answer I believe is that someone
practised enough in writing with chalk on a vertical surface!
This is the part of the question that bugs me most.....because despite knowing that there was always graffiti about and that writing in chalk could be found on cafe boards,market stalls etc how much of the population of Whitechapel let alone of that largely immigrant Jewish quarter around and in the Wentworth dwellings could actually,in 1888, read or write such a piece of graffiti?
IMHO not that many people would have been practised enough or literate enough to have.
But a school teacher or a Sunday school teacher even-maybe.
In every other detailed way the article covers so much-the stuff about the lighting in particular is very thought provoking indeed and a great contribution IMHO to ripper studies!
Ciao
Nats |
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