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Chris Scott
Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 290
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 09, 2003 - 7:46 pm: | 
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I have been doingsome further work on this and thought it might be of interest.
DAVIES - MARY JANE KELLY'S HUSBAND
From the A-Z:
"....she had married Davies, a collier, c 1879 and he died in a mine explosion two or three years later...."
So, we are looking for a Welsh mining disaster in 1881 or 1882 whose victims included a DAVIES or DAVIS.
In fact 1881 was notable in the lack of fatalities for that year. In 1882 there were three incidents that resulted in fatalities:
On January 15th 1882, at Risca pit 4 died
On February 11th 1882, at Coedcae pit, 6 died.
On March 3rd 1882 at Henwaen Blaina, 5 died.
The death roll for the Coedcae incident on February 11th is:
George Warlow
Thomas Williams
Jacob Thomas
Howell James Lewis
Benjamin James
Joseph Rowlands
The Henwaen Blaina incident is described thus:
"On 3rd March 1882, five men were killed in a localised explosion. It was reported that their bodies had been blown a considerable distance."
A photograph exists of the workforce before this explosion
The death roll was:
William Bennet aged 26
? Hawkins aged 65
? Jones aged 42
John Jones aged 48
Thomas Miles aged 25
The Risca incident of January 15th 1882 I am unable to list as the database I consulted only includes death rolls of 5 or more names.
There is one incident which occurred on December 10th 1880 and so impinges very closely on the possible time frame we are looking at.
This disaster occurred at the Naval Steam Colliery, Penygraig and resulted in 96 deaths. From the death roll the following names and details are taken:
Evan Davies aged 49 from Coedymeibion, married with 4 children
Evan Davies, no details
John Davies, aged 42 from Penygraig, married with 2 children
John Davies, no details
John Davies, no details
William Davies from Ffwrdamos
William R Davies aged 23 from Penygraig
The deaths were registered in the Jan-March quarter of 1881 under the district of Pontypridd.
Evan Davies aged 49 is listed
Evan Davies, no details was 32 at the time of death.
John Davies aged 42 is listed
John Davies, no details: the other John Davies entries for Pontypridd give the following ages: 96, 0, 56, 56
(The first two can safely be discounted!)
William R Davies aged 23 (middle name is Roderick) is listed
William Davies, no details: the other William Davies entries for Pontypridd give the following ages: 60, 21, 8, 26, 14.
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Paul Williams
Police Constable
Username: Wehrwulf
Post Number: 6
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, September 28, 2003 - 5:41 pm: |
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There was an earlier disaster at Risca on 16th July 1880. The death list is at http://www.welshcoalmines.co.uk/deathrolls/Risca.htm and contains 18 year-old James Davies, an assistant mason and 34 year-old William Davies, a stower. Several colliers also died. |
Richard Brian Nunweek
Inspector
Username: Richardn
Post Number: 268
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, September 29, 2003 - 4:03 am: |
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Hi Paul.
18 year old James Davies , is an intresting possibility, for two reasons.
A] He obviously is the right age group for kelly.
B]was she not extremely fond of a Joseph Flemming, who happened to be a mason by trade, the attraction that he was of the same profession as her dead first love,could be a distinct possibility.
Intresting.
Regards Richard. |
Paul Williams
Police Constable
Username: Wehrwulf
Post Number: 8
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 1:53 pm: |
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Hi Richard
I have found 3 men named James Davies who were married in Pontypridd in the relevant period. Their spouses were Lydia Jones, Ann Evans and Catherine Cross. |
Paul Williams
Police Constable
Username: Wehrwulf
Post Number: 9
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 4:13 pm: |
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Following on from the above I did a similar search for Camarthen, bearing in mind that it is one area where the Kelly family could have come from. There were two interesting hits concerning the marriage of James Davies. On each page of the registry for this period there are normally 2 marriages recorded. One the page for Camarthen June 1877, three individuals are listed as being married. They were James Davies, Evan Howells and Anne Lewis. The name of the other bride is missing and could only be found by someone tracking down the original register, and deciphering it (the online register has ignored illegible names). The second interesting transaction is a marriage in December 1879 between James Davies and Mary Davies. It isn't unknown for someone to have the same maiden and married name but there is the possibility of an error in transcribing, which again could only be confirmed by access to the original register. Any casebook readers in that area of Wales? |
Richard Brian Nunweek
Inspector
Username: Richardn
Post Number: 270
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2003 - 4:41 pm: |
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Hi Paul.
According to Barnett she married aged 16 , therefore 1879 would be the date, could it be possible that , this was the couple. albeit a long shot, mayby we should start researching into Mary Davies born in 1863?.
Intresting Paul..
Regards Richard. |
Chris Scott
Chief Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 587
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 01, 2003 - 2:26 pm: |
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Paul
If you got the three names from Free BMD, the three names might represent only one marriage. It is not uncommon for the register any witness as well.
Chris |
Chris Scott
Chief Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 588
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 01, 2003 - 2:31 pm: |
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Paul
very interested in your research
Barnett's accounts would give this rough chronology:
Mary Jane Kelly
Born 1863 in Limerick
Moved "when young" to Wales
Married 1879
Davies/Davis killed 1881/1882
Kelly then moved to Cardiff where she lived with a cousin and spent time in the Infirmary
1884 Moved to London
Anything Barnett says must be taken with a large pinch of salt, not necessarily because he would have lied but because the only possible source is Kelly herself and we have no way of knowing how much of the above is true.
Chris |
Chris Scott
Chief Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 589
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 01, 2003 - 2:33 pm: |
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Re the above, as Kelly is supoosed to have spent the best part of year following the death of her husband, I will see if I can find the listing for Cardiff Infirmary in the 1881 census
Chris |
Robert Charles Linford
Chief Inspector
Username: Robert
Post Number: 878
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 01, 2003 - 3:20 pm: |
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Chris, on a whim I just put "Morag Davies/Davis" into the LDS, and it gave me a load of Sarahs. Any idea why it should do this?
Robert |
Chris Scott
Chief Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 591
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 01, 2003 - 3:47 pm: |
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Hi Robert
Did you specify "exact spelling"? If not it can come up with some screwy matches
Chris
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Robert Charles Linford
Chief Inspector
Username: Robert
Post Number: 880
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 01, 2003 - 4:36 pm: |
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Hi Chris
I have now specified exact spelling......and got no matches. (at least for born in Ireland).
It's tough, this census lark!
Robert |
Robert Charles Linford
Chief Inspector
Username: Robert
Post Number: 909
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, October 05, 2003 - 6:17 pm: |
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Hi,
Don't suppose this is the right one, but I'll post it anyway as she was in an infirmary.
Mary Davies, patient, unmarried, age 20, born Abergwilly, Carmarthen, General Servant (Dom). "Infirmary" Priory Street, Carmarthen St Peter, Carmarthen, Wales.
I've been running my eye down the LDS Mary Davies entries, looking for patient or cousin or inmate. I've done 1400 and don't know how many more there are to go!
Robert
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Paul Williams
Police Constable
Username: Wehrwulf
Post Number: 10
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, October 23, 2003 - 4:35 pm: |
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There is an online list of people killed in mining accidents in the UK at http://www.cmhrc.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/lodts.htm However there are a lot of Davies listed in the relevant period and it is not split into region. |
Donald Souden
Police Constable
Username: Supe
Post Number: 5
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, October 23, 2003 - 6:15 pm: |
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Robert, most likely the reason you got a lot of Sarahs when seeking Morag Davies/Davis is that Morag is Scots-Gaelic for Sarah. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1072
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, October 23, 2003 - 6:26 pm: |
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Hi Donald
Thanks for that. I'd never have guessed that one!
Robert
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Sarah Long
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Friday, October 24, 2003 - 4:13 am: |
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Hi all,
Just was looking for all deaths listed from september 1888 to december 1888 on the FreeBMD website (http://freebmd.rootsweb.com) and I found Mary!! She is listed as Marie Jeanette Davies!! Unfortunately this is all the information it tells us apart from the fact that she was 25 and died in Whitechapel. It is definately her. It is listed under Dec 1888 deaths as they are only listed at the end of March, June, September and December. Didn't find anything about her marriage though.
Didn't know Morag was also Sarah, what a horrible version of my name. |
Richard Brian Nunweek
Inspector
Username: Richardn
Post Number: 342
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, October 24, 2003 - 3:29 pm: |
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Sarah,
Her death certificate, names her as Marie, Jeannete kelly Davies, marie jeanette, was the name she was known affectionately by Barnett, her common version therefore Mary Jane.
It is entirely possible that her real name was Mary Jane Davies, her maiden name being the same as her married name.
The research for whoever is clever enough should be to determine if 18 year old james Davies killed in the risca disaster in july 1880, was married, and if so his wifes name on the certificate, if this could be determined , possible jackpot.....
Richard. |
Sarah Long
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Monday, October 27, 2003 - 9:18 am: |
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Richard,
I realise that this thread is about trying to find out about her possible husband's death but I just wanted to share what I had found as I had put this on other threads but no-one had said anything about it. The reason I found it exciting was that no-one had seemed to track her down at all and I thought it was interesting that I had finally found her name somewhere other than on here or on her death certificate. |
SimonOwen
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Sunday, November 23, 2003 - 12:40 am: |
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You may be interested in this : a James Thomas DAVIES married a Mary Jane ALLEN in the Jan-March period 1880 in Merthyr Tydfil Wales : this James Thomas Davies was born Sept-Dec 1861 so he would have been 18 in July 1880. There are other candidates for the James Davies killed at the Risca disaster however. |
Sarah Long
Detective Sergeant
Username: Sarah
Post Number: 89
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 - 12:12 pm: |
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That's quite a good one Simon. The town of Merthyr Tydfil seems to be popping up a lot. |
Jason Scott Mullins
Sergeant
Username: Crix0r
Post Number: 27
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Monday, November 24, 2003 - 1:30 pm: |
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I agree Sarah, that town does seem to have pop'd up on more than one occasion.. Oh, btw, good job on your postin' spree  I only wish I had more time myself to dedicate to the boards >=/
crix0r |
Sarah Long
Detective Sergeant
Username: Sarah
Post Number: 97
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 25, 2003 - 6:14 am: |
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Jason,
I'm just too opinionated.
Sarah |
Jason Scott Mullins
Sergeant
Username: Crix0r
Post Number: 29
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 25, 2003 - 9:18 am: |
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Sarah -
I don't know if there is such a thing on a message board However, being highly opinionated is a good thing in my book, so I welcome it.
crix0r |
Sarah Long
Detective Sergeant
Username: Sarah
Post Number: 103
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 25, 2003 - 9:23 am: |
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Jason,
Well I am certainly that!!  Also I keep getting all sorts of ideas about this case and if I don't voice it somehow I'll go mad!! No-one I know is interested in this case, I don't know what's the matter with them....
Sarah |
Jason Scott Mullins
Sergeant
Username: Crix0r
Post Number: 34
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 25, 2003 - 10:22 am: |
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Sarah -
I hate to be the bearer of bad news: Alot of people will not be interested.. I'd say most don't care and even fewer can follow up if they did care. There are a few prerequisite that must be met. You can't have a weak stomach, etc. Fairly similar to the requirements that a coroner has.
What I'm saying is that it's not a job for just 'anybody'.. I suppose ripper hunting isn't either
crix0r |
Sarah Long
Detective Sergeant
Username: Sarah
Post Number: 108
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 25, 2003 - 10:37 am: |
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Jason,
It actually surprised me when I came across this site and how many books were out there. All my friends think it's a sick fasination but I've reassured them that I won't be killing them and cutting them up so I think the're ok.
Think I'm gonna have another go at looking up this Davies bloke. Might have look at Merthyr Tydfil again too. |
Chris Scott
Chief Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 933
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 12:35 pm: |
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Re: the colliery disaster. I was looking up something unrelated to this in the Tom Cullen book today when I saw this in the chapter about the Kelly murder:
"..... Davies was killed in a mine explosion. The mineowners stalled for eighteen months before paying her a miserable pittance by way of a widow's compensation, and it was this delay which drove Mary on to the streets, first in the Tiger Bay region of Cardiff, and later in London."
Does anyone have any idea regarding the sources of the two assertions that the compenastion was delayed and also that she worked the Tiger Bay area as a prostitute?
Many thanks
Chris
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Paul Williams
Sergeant
Username: Wehrwulf
Post Number: 18
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 2:14 pm: |
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Risca Colliery 16th of July 1880
Davies, James 18, Assistant Mason,
Davies, William 34, Stower,
This is a list of men named Davies who died in mining accidents, with 5 or more fatalities, in Wales between 1880 and 1887.
Naval Colliery 10th of December 1880
Davies, Charles Trealaw, Married, 2 Children,
Davies, Evan 49, Coedymeibion, Married, 4 Children
Davies, Evan - -
Davies, John 42 Penygraig, Married, 2 Children
Davies, John - -
Davies, John - -
Davies, William Ffwrdamos, Single
Davies, William 23 Penygraig, Single
Naval Colliery 27th of January 1884
DAVIES, Thomas (alias "Double Power") Condtractor
Pochin Colliery 8th of November 1884
Davies, John Blackwood
23/12/1885 Maerdy Colliery
Davies, Thomas 49 I Thomas Street
Davies, Thomas 13 1 Thomas Street, Son of Thomas
Davies, Isaac 33 4 Morgan Place
Davies, Evan 28 6 Rowley Terrace
Davies, William 25 35 Ferndale Road
Davies, John 17 113 Mardy Road
Davies, Evan 19 8 Hill Street
Davies, Lewis 32 41 Mardy Road
Davies, Richard 28 Ceridon Street
Ynyshir, Standard Colliery 18th of February 1887
Davies, Daniel 22 20 Hillside Terrace
Davies, Henry - -
Davies, Morgan 40 James Street
Davies, Morris 28 Llewellyn Street
I'm not sure how compensation worked at that time. If it was an isolated incident, with Davies the only one killed, then maybe it would have been easier for the owners to stall on payments to the widow. |
Paul Williams
Sergeant
Username: Wehrwulf
Post Number: 21
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 4:58 pm: |
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This extract of the Risca tragedy in 1880 is taken from the Welsh coal mines website and is described as a contemporary newspaper account.
Yet another colliery explosion, and this one within a few miles of Newport, Verily, we are doomed to received many harrowing lessons as to the perils which attend the miners vocation.
The scene of calamity, which is now our painful duty to record is a pit known as The New Pit near Cross Keys, Risca, and situated about seven miles from Newport.
Here, at half-past one yesterday (Thursday) morning an explosion of Fire damp took place, hurrying, as there is grave reason to fear, not less than 120 poor fellows into eternity.
The works belong to the London and South Wales Colliery Company, an undertaking in which Messrs Watts, Milburn & Co,. Shipowners etc. London, are the principle shareholders; Mr. Watts acting as Managing Director.
The undertaking which, so far at least, as the question of employment is concerned, is a boon to the neighbourhood is among the largest of it’s kind, about 700 hands being employed, the coal output was about 1,000 tons per day.
A severe thunderstorm was prevailing at the time of the explosion.
The Colliery bears the name of the Risca New Pit, and it was worked by two shafts, each being 285 yards deep and 17 feet six inches in diameter. The colliery is ventilated by one of the best fans known – Guibal’s – 40 feet in diameter. The pit being opened for about three years.
The Colliers left their work at the usual hour on Wednesday night, when everything seemed to be in a state of perfect safety. At 10.30 pm. The Night Fireman, named Isopp, reported the mine exceptionally free from gas, and every part in good order.
Then the Repairers – men who look after the timbering and mason work whilst the colliers are at home, went down to the number of 119 men and boys, who would have worked until six o’clock am on Thursday morning. For some hours the repairers proceeded with their allotted tasks without interruption, and nothing transpired to alarm those on the surface until about half past one o’clock when the sound of an explosion was heard. Above ground it’s effects were most felt at the upcast shaft where the engine working the ventilating fan is situated, and the engine driver had a most remarkable escape. The staging around this shaft was destroyed, and the engine-room completely wrecked, though composed of brick-work and embedded in Portland cement, and therefore, of great strength. Fortunately, for the driver of the engine he had quit his station a moment or two before the gas in the mine had fired, and so escaped instant death, for the platform on which he had stood whilst at his post, was shattered to pieces.
The fan itself had suffered serious damage and could not be kept in motion. The ventilation of the pit was therefore being stopped. A circumstance, which prevented any attempt being made to descend the downcast shaft for a considerable time. By eight o’clock however, ventilation was restored, and a band of brave explorers, consisting of Evan Evans, underground-Manager, Thomas Purnell, Overman, John Davies and Stephen Crook, Firemen, together with John Loader and David Kenvin made a successful effort to enter the workings. Almost immediately they found the body of Bowden the Hitcher who had gone to work but a very few moments before the explosion.
The first party of explorers was immediately followed by Mr. Llewelyn, General Manager of the colliery, and 17 men. They remained underground for five hours without communicating with the surface, and fears were entertained for their safety. But, at length, the party returned safely to the bank with the lamentable tidings that there were no hopes of saving life, and that 119 men lay below them at sleep which knows no waking. They further reported that 69 horses had perished in numerous falls.
A large crowd had assembled in the neighbourhood of the colliery. The Police (under the command of Supt. McIntosh, Pontypool, and Supt. Foll, Tredegar), drew a cordon however around the pit, and but a few persons were permitted inside the barriers. The mass, which increased in volume as the day advanced, was a very orderly throng, though apparently not much impressed with the disaster. As usual, the nearest public house did a "roaring trade", every room being crowded with thirsty customers. Here and there may be seen a weeping woman, accompanied by her little ones.
The mining inspectors were under the impression that the gas was fire near to the upcast shaft. The pit is worked by safety lamps, and the lamp-man declares that all those given out by him on the Wednesday night shift were in good order.
Soon after Mr. Llewelyn and his party came out of the pit the body of the Hitcher was brought to the bank and placed in a hastily-constructed mortuary close to hand. The poor fellows corpse was badly scorched. The watch which he carried a stopped at exactly half-past one o’clock. Between three and four o’clock it was stated that two other bodies, those of a father and son name Thomas and John Jones, Masons, had been found not far from one of the shafts. The father had been badly burned about the face and hands, whilst the son had been crushed on the head. Up until five o’clock only three bodies had been got out, Mr. Cadman said that the remainder may not be reached for a day or two until the "falls" are removed.
Sixteen bodies were recovered on Friday night, and on Friday the explorers penetrated 700 yards from the downcast shaft. Also, during the Friday night, a number of dead horses were got out, and their carcasses disposed of.
Saturday An exploring party went in about 150 yards along the main dip. The efforts of these men being concentrated on the task of clearing away the great fall which occurred on the intake and return, so as to restore the ventilation. A number of bodies were noticed underneath the falls. The supply of fresh air was not sufficient to overcome the gas which remained. Some time ago there was a great fall, the roof on the intake came crashing down. The Arch over the tunnel some 60 yards more or less from the bottom of the shaft. Other portions of the arch were squeezed at the sides to such a degree that the apex shot upwards, and the whole was in imminent danger of falling; but it was securely propped, and men were employed in clearing debris that had fallen, also in widening the tunnel (intake air-way).
This having been done, mason were employed in erecting a small wall on each side of the widened road, and on top of the wall on each side was place an immense beam with another great beam across, above the roadway. The fall was about 20 feet in length.
The bodies of four men were recovered in the course of Saturday, and during the day Mr. Watts, the Chairman of the company went amongst the bereaved administrating relief.
The inquest was opened in the afternoon at the T. A. Inn by E. B. Edwards.
No bodies were brought out on Sunday, but 21 horses were brought to the bank.
Several funerals took place on Sunday.
On Monday the bodies of 13 of the deceased were got out of the workings, some in a dreadfully mangled condition, so much so that only ten of them could be identified. Cornelius Ford, aged 16, it may be said that fate had always been against him. Some years ago when quite a youngster, he had the misfortune to lose a arm and a leg by being run over on the railway line near the coke ovens at Risca, both limbs were so badly injured that Dr. Robotham amputated them the same night. He was fitted with a wooden leg, and as he grew in stature he had to be re-fitted to suit his altered condition. Latterly he had been employed as an underground time keeper.
On Tuesday night the three remaining unknown bodies were identified, also two more bodies were brought up from the mine.
Relief meeting held at Newport. Mr. W. C. Cartwright, who had collected the money for the 1860 explosion. £7000 to £8,000, there now remained some £1,000, the weekly payments having dwindled down from £23 to £2.13s or £2.16s. Of course the surviving recipients of the old fund must be considered.
On Wednesday the men were engaged in cutting a "stout hole" for the air current. This was accomplished late last night, and soon after several more bodies were recovered.
Five more bodies were found on Thursday, and brought to the surface, and they were all placed in coffins and immediately screwed down.
Up to last evening 44 bodies had been recovered leaving 76 to be accounted for.
Money collected to date £1,778.14.1d……..July 30th, 1880.
On Saturday two more bodies were brought up, they were scorched as the other bodies had been.
During Friday night the workmen went beyond the second "stout hole" which had been cut, and got around to the end of Harvey’s level.
Mr. Robotham writes to the British Medical Journal with reference to the disaster. "I may say that the majority of those scorched would have recovered had the ventilation not been stopped".
Having lived in Risca 40 years, and seen the results of many explosions, I have never seen such mangling of bodies, limbs twisted from their sockets, legs fractured – not from falls, they seem to have been affected by several currents of whirlwinds. The skulls were, in many cases, fractured and not a portion of the brain left.
Since Sunday three more bodies have been recovered, making 50 in all.
August 13th Risca explosion fund, the amount so far £7,200. The number of widows and children is 302.
August 27th Three more bodies have been recovered making a total of 107, leaving 13 more still in the pit.
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Caroline Anne Morris
Chief Inspector
Username: Caz
Post Number: 839
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 7:20 am: |
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Hi All,
I know this is going to sound awful, but I wonder whether it was common for East End prostitutes to have a believable and tragic hard luck story tucked up their sleeves to use when needed to explain just how they came to be so 'unfortunate'.
Liz Stride seems to have told a tall tale about her family being lost when the Princess Alice went down in the Thames, for instance. Nothing like a good old disaster, that leaves a poor widow woman fending for herself, to tug at the old heart - and purse - strings.
Sorry, I shouldn't have mentioned it, but it just struck me as a similarly plausible-sounding sob story that such women could have used. I mean no offence.
Love,
Caz |
David Knott
Sergeant
Username: Dknott
Post Number: 32
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 8:04 am: |
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Sounds perfectly plausible to me Caz. Might also explain why she went by the name Mary Kelly and not Mary Davies.
David |
Alan Sharp
Chief Inspector
Username: Ash
Post Number: 506
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2004 - 8:56 am: |
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Caz
You could add to that Annie Chapman's tale of being the widow of a Windsor Vetinary Surgeon. Not a sob-story as such, but it does make her fall seem all the more tragic than being the widow of a coachman. |
Paul Williams
Sergeant
Username: Wehrwulf
Post Number: 42
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 01, 2005 - 5:28 pm: |
|
This is a list of mining disasters with five or more fatalities in Wales between 1879 and 1885. One problem is that Kelly's husband, if he existed, may have died in an isolated incident. My feeling is that we can eliminate the North Wales incidents because of Kelly's move to Cardiff. I have listed the Davies killed in these cases and indicated the ones where further research is needed to identify the victims.
Bedwellty. Tredegar 2nd. April, 1879 5 killed,
Bedwellty. Tredegar 10th. March 1880 6 killed, (identities not known)
Bersham Wrexham 3 August 1880 9 killed,
Coedcae (New) Pontypridd 11th. February, 1882
Coedcae (Old) Pontypridd 1st. February, 1883 Dinas, Rhonda, 13th January, 1879, 63 killed
including a widower Evan Davies and a single man Edward Davies. Two victims unknown.
Garnant, Cwmammam, 16th January 1884. 10 killed.
Garnoch, Swansea, 7th July 1880 Number of dead and identities not known.
Gelli, Ystrad, 21st August 1883, 5 dead
Lewis Merthyr, Coedcae, 11th February 1882, 6 dead.
Lewis Merthyr, Coedcae, 1st February 1883, 5 dead.
Maerdy, Rhondda, 23rd December, 1885, 81 dead including
Davies, Thomas Age 49 I Thomas Street
Davies, Thomas 13 1 Thomas Street, Son of Thomas
Davies, Isaac 33 4 Morgan Place
Davies, Evan 28 6 Rowley Terrace
Davies, William 25 35 Ferndale Road
Davies, John 17 113 Mardy Road
Davies, Evan 19 8 Hill Street
Davies, Lewis 32 41 Mardy Road
Davies, Richard n/k 28 Ceridon Street
Naval Penygraig, 10th December 1880, 96 dead including
Davies, Evan Age 49 Coedymeibion, Married, 4 Children
Davies, Evan
Davies, John Age 42 Penygraig, Married, 2 Children
Davies, John
Davies, John
Davies, William Ffwrdamos, Single
Davies, William R Age 23 Penygraig, Single
Naval, Penygraig, 27th January, 1884. 14 dead including DAVIES, Thomas (alias "Double Power") Contractor
Naval, Penygraig, 1888 (date n/k) 11 dead
New Duffryn, Rhymney, 25th June 1883, 6 dead, 2 unidentified.
Oakwood Levels Maesteg 16th January 1884 10 dead
Pochin, Tredegar, 8th November 1884, 15 dead including John Davies from Blackwood
Risca New Mine, 15th July 1880, 120 dead including James Davies Age 18, Assistant Mason and William Davies Age 34 Stower
Waun Pit, Cwmavon, 24th June 1879, six dead, identities not known
Information from http://www.welshcoalmines.co.uk/DisastersList.htm
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Ditto
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 1:18 am: |
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Hi
Does Mary's husband have to have been killed in a mining disaster in Wales?
News of the World Sept 19 1886 has an article about a colliery explosion at the Dean Lane Colliery in Bristol.
There were 10 fatalities one of them was a Richard Davis aged 27.
He died leaving a wife and a child.
His death is registered in the Sept Quarter 1886 at Bedminster.
As you would expect I tried to find the marriage of Richard Davis.
There is a marriage listed in the June Quarter 1883 in Bedminster.
The wife was either a Mary Harriet Day or an Emily Elizabeth Crew.
I'm not sure whether it's worth delving further into or not.
Has anyone else come across this Davis?
Probably just another needle in a huge haystack!
Regards Di |
Paul Williams
Detective Sergeant
Username: Wehrwulf
Post Number: 51
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 1:03 pm: |
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Hi Ditto
I suppose the accident could have happened outside of Wales, if it happened at all, but September 1886 is perhaps too late since Kelly's presence in London that year is confirmed by other witnesses. |
Ditto
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Friday, June 10, 2005 - 10:18 pm: |
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Hi Paul
Thanks for that info.
It might be worth exploring the posssibility that the disaster occurred outside of Wales.
I believe coal miners were something of a transient work force.
Many moved between the coal fields in Somerset, Cheshire, Staffordshire etc.
This can make it very difficult to track them.
It is possible that Mary and her husband may have moved from Wales further afield.
It is a mammoth task,if only Mary had married a Humperdinck!
Keep up the great work.
Regards Di
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Glenn Ross
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Sunday, October 09, 2005 - 9:54 pm: |
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Hi all,
I think it is fascinating trying to track down Mary Kelly. I understand that it will be very difficult to do so because of the frequency of the name Mary Kelly, destruction/lack of records, etc. and because the name itself may very well have been a false name. I conducted a cursory search assuming for the sake of the search that Mary was telling the truth (to Joe B.) about being married to a Davis/Davies who dies in a mining accident around 1881, but also assuming that Mary Jane Kelly may have been a false name, at least in part (meaning that Mary or Jane was truthful [arbitrary I know]). I searched using the forenames of Davis/Davies who died in mining accidents in Wales (these were just the right name combinations e.g.: James Davies, not necessarily the James Davies who died in a mining accident, because I could not tell) at roughly the right time who had married within 2 years of 1878 (roughly when MJK claimed to have married). The interesting marriages, meaning that the brides name contained "Mary" or "Jane," I found were:
1. "Evan Davies" married a "Jane" of Aberdare, Glamorgan in Aberdare, Glamorgan.
2. "Edward Davies" married a "Bridget Kelly" in Wrexham.
3. "William Davies" married a "Mary Roberts" of Carnarvon, Caernarvon in Carnarvon, Caernarvon in about 1876.
4. "John William Davies" married a "Mary Ann Palmer" of Methyr Tydfil, Glamorgan in about 1875. |
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