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Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 11
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 26, 2003 - 3:12 pm: | 
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In August 1873 he lodged with Mrs Ursula Loyer and her daughter Eugenie who ran a small school.He fell madly in love with Eugenie who rejected him and some rows ensued involving Vincent"s mother and father who were most upset at the way their son was treated.Vincent and his sister Anna left quickly and took a place in Kennington Road.He left sometime in 1875 returning to Isleworth and a teaching position
in1876.That too soon got into difficulties and he moved to Twickenham Road.
In 1888 he was in Arles waiting for Gaugin and hoping to establish an artists colony there but that was when he took off his ear and everything
in his life fell apart.
I agree that Thomas needed an airing.It"s not finished yet either.
Blake-fantastic!
from Natalie to A.P. |
AP Wolf
Chief Inspector
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 587
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 26, 2003 - 5:12 pm: |
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Interesting that Vincent's long and winding road took him to Kennington, perhaps he dangled young Thomas on his knee and confused him with visions of sunflowers, golden fields and wormwood inspired nirvana?
I might be wrong but I reckon Gaugin was a sinister sod who wanted to steal Vincent's simple soul and better stroke with the brush.
William Blake is the only man to have touched god.
It was all fuelled by wormwood, I can't afford the muck at £30 a bottle and do my best on SSB at £8 a hit.
Keep airing young Thomas, he is awfully interesting, even artful. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1396
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 7:06 am: |
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WHATEVER HAPPENED TO...?
Little girl's delighted cries,
Eyes wide open with surprise,
Sees magician pull from hat...
Not a rabbit but a rat.
Sad old drunken whore
Falls to filthy floor.
Little boy can't button shirt,
Fingers tug at mummy's skirt,
Artless fingers that implore...
Fingers wrapped round neck of whore.
Lifts her skirt for celebration
Of magician's transformation.
Bishops' God, maker of all,
Hears each sparrow's feathery fall,
God of mercy, God of love...
Turns his TV on with shove.
Sees the final slash,
Flicks his cigarette ash.
Robert |
AP Wolf
Chief Inspector
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 589
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 8:45 am: |
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Ah Robert
I've said it before but I'll say it again, you are Blake incarnate when you want to be.
That was a blessing of a poesie, quite wonderful, and the words just melt into one another effortlessly and take one from bright childhood to dark adulthood in an instant.
The ending is masterful, one can see the idle flick of ash descending... so final.
Superb, Robert Blake Linford. |
Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 12
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 8:58 am: |
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Yes brilliant Robert and very redolent of Blake its true.
A.P.Vincent became quite tormented by Gaugin.Not a pleasing character at all.
Must get on with the conversation now.Natalie |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1400
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 9:56 am: |
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Hi AP, Natalie
Thanks very much! I wanted to do a serious one before you went off on holiday, AP. Glad it went down well.
Robert |
Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 13
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 10:15 am: |
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Characters conversing with one another in a queue.
They are all waiting for a messenger to tell them what to do next.Different people keep joining them
with different troubles and past trauma.Up to now there are Vincent Van Gogh,Catharine Eddowes,
Montague Druitt,and the most recent to join them is Thomas Cutbush.Thomas has just finished telling his tale.
Kate;[she is looking very intrigued by Thomas and his story]Am I right in saying you were in Mitre Square the night he did me in and that you were dressed as a policeman?
Thomas;Yes.Thats right.
Kate;Whereabouts in the Square?
Thomas;Quite near by at one point when you were talking to him.
Kate;I remember catching sight of a policeman
[looks annoyed with herself and bites her lip]
All I can remember is thinking he might be after me what with being in clink just beforehand.It was when the bloke I was talking too was looking at some chaps that were standing behind us. I think he thought they were staring our way...and it was soon after that that it must have happened
because all I can remember is him not being willing to part with any coppers.[carries on trying to recall the events of that night]I had come across him as I was walking down Hounsditch
just near Church passage.I"remember being so strapped for cash I didnt have the money for the doss that night so I just asked him for afew coppers to get me by. He was humming and haaing
like I didnt ought to be stopping him that way and I just says something quietly to him can"t remember exactlywhat-but along the lines of me being very hard up and would he see me walk the streets all night and when he started to look a bit more friendly I put my hand on his chest and I think I said he looked a good sort-something like that anyway but it was about then I fancied he was moving away from me -I wish I could remember what happened next all I know is that Ifelt this terrible pain in my eye and my head spinnin"....thats all I knew......I wish I could remember I do.
Just then a tallish man who looks a bit eccentric
arrives to join them.
Tallish man;How do you do all of you .
Stephensons the name Robert Donston Stephenson
Vincent;Goodday Sir[[he goes to stand up and introduce himself]
Stephenson;Can anyone guess what I do for a living
or rather what I like doing most for a living?
Kate[to Vincent,through her teeth]Well-we"ve got a Queer one here for sure.[Vincent tries to pretend he hasn"t heard this]
Stephenson[enjoying himself by now]I can cure the itch the stitch,the spots or the gout if there"s ten devils in...
[at this point Montague starts up and begins to berate him vehemently]
Vincent;WHOAHH-steady on old chap he"s only having a joke you know-no need to lose your rag
old chap.
Montague sinks back onto his chair muttering to himself.
Kate[turning to Vincent sharply]I told you he was a right one didnt I?
to be continued.Natalie
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Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1402
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 10:37 am: |
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Hi Natalie
Enjoying each instalment. I like the way Kate can't remember. Just don't do a Saddam on us and leave us guessing!
Robert |
AP Wolf
Chief Inspector
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 591
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 1:05 pm: |
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There was a bearded chap called Freud
Whose theories you couldn’t avoid
And whose ideas did grievously vex
For he claimed that all murder was sex
And since then has kept the profilers employed.
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Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 14
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 1:06 pm: |
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Montague;[lifts head and shakes himself]Where are we I wonder-the in between place I think.We used to call it purgatory.[partly to himself]To purge
to purify...to make spiritually or physically clean...he looks around at his new friends...I used to play cricket -beautiful game.England in Summer playing cricket .I shall miss it I know.
But I was getting awfully depressed latterly.
I know other people might be quite envious of me-
good education public school,then Oxford,good social circle Chambers in the city etc but the truth isI was often depressed.It would come on without warning-the sleeplessness,then the racing thoughts and the compulsions.I could never relax
and then there were the visions...
Kate;[interrupting rather rudely]Oh you"re not on about that peculiar stuff again are you.I"ll tell you this I wish I"d had some of your education to help me get by.I was an orphan in Bermondsey Workhouse by the time I was 14. Just half your chance mate would have done me.I went to school
did well there too-didnt want to leave and fend for myself the way I did.No wonder I turned to drink.
Montague[slightly contrite]Well yes.We do know about the plight of the poor and Dickens has done so much to bring it to public attention,don"t you think.
Kate;Not enough mate not enough.
Thomas;Well I had agood job before I caught syphilis from one of those unfortunates.
Vincent;[eager to join in now]Really-I caught that from my wife once very nasty I do sympathise.
Thomas[astonished]Your "wife" did you say Sir.
Vincent;Thats right dear Sien a sweet lovely girl and an unfortunate as you call them.My father tried to have me committed to an asylum over it.
They disapproved of me violently because I was in love with her.My folk had always been so good to me until then but that changed everything.
Kate;It takes all sorts as they say.
Montague [scratching his head]My mother and father would have been horrified by that I must say.Was she a great beauty then?
Vincent;Quite the contrary and that was one of the reasons I loved her.You see I want to call the whole of society into question in my paintings
I like to paint peasants toiling in the fields-not your affluent bourgeoisie.
Montague[warming to Vincent despite himself]
Yes I know I can hear the evangelist in you and I understand that.
to be continued |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1403
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 2:41 pm: |
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You're a fast worker, Natalie! Keep it coming.
Nice one, AP. I confess I haven't made a thorough study of the old boy's works, or those of his acolytes. But there are definite batteners out there, so...
CONSULTING ROOM
Ego, superego, id -
That'll cost you plenty quid.
Do I spy castration complex?
That'll cost you many kopecks.
And of course there's Oedipus,
For I am a greedy cus.
Trauma at birth?
Let's see what that's worth...
Now word association test.
Just relax and do your best.
Psychoanalysis.
"General paralysis."
Sexual perversion.
"Currency conversion."
Psychobabbling.
"Film star dabbling."
Phallic symbol.
"Phallic symbol."
God, you're a wreck.
"Will you take a cheque?"
Robert
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Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 15
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 4:13 pm: |
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The Conversation;
Stephenson;[who has since Montague"s outburst been sitting quietly next to Vincent]Hello,hello
hello [all turn to look at whoever it is arriving,a young damaged looking man has joined them.
Damaged looking man[takes a seat without saying Hello to anyone and takes out a pair of nail scissors and starts to cut his toenails paying particular attention to the corners.When these were done he began on his finger nails he finished by holding up the scissors and making swift open and shut movements with them and then he began to sing to himself]
Stephenson[trying to break the ice]Good with the scissors are you?Always keep a pair of them handy?
Damaged looking young man;twists his body into himself and rocks gently to and fro.
Thomas [softly to Vincent and Kate]He used to be a hair dresser.But I think he might have got sacked for not turning up.I used to go in the barbers shop he worked in.That was a bit before all the trouble.I think he was called Kosminski
but the customers used to call him David.
Kate;I know him from somewhere too.
to be continued |
Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 16
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 5:59 pm: |
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Robert your poem is very clever.I havesome hesitation about joining the attack on Freud.
He did pioneer all that work on the subconscious
but un the other hand a whole industry does seem to have grown around his work.I don"t doubt that he was an oddity and that much of his evidence may have been bogus but so what-why not take what you want from it and leave the rest?
speaking of which I think I"ll have a rest from my story.I don"t need to supply an ending-why can"t we accept a state of uncertainty as Keats would recommend?Best Natalie |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1406
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 6:14 pm: |
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Hi Natalie
Hope you get back to your story when you feel ready, as I was really into it. No, by all means you don't have to tell us who the Ripper was - any more than McGoohan told us who Number One was (well he did, but not really!) What I meant earlier, was that I was looking forward to seeing how it all would turn out.
Re Freud, I have this feeling that he asked new and interesting questions - often more than half the battle - but I'm not sure about some of his answers. I did like his Gestapo joke. If you haven't heard that one, I'll post it next time.
Robert |
Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 17
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 6:33 pm: |
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Robert thanks for the response.re Freud I think thats about where I am too-as Peter Abelard said"By doubting we come to questioning and through questioning we perceive the truth"-not bad for the 12thcentury dont you think?
look forward to your words.Natalie |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1408
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 27, 2003 - 7:08 pm: |
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Hi Natalie
Ah! With this chap it's no longer the castration complex - it's the real thing!
I like people who are always questioning. Mind you, when it's a child who's doing the questioning it can drive you up the wall!
Robert |
AP Wolf
Chief Inspector
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 595
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 10:24 am: |
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Yes I've been enjoying Natalie's story as it unfolds. Well Robert, if Natalie won't write the end then I guess we'll have to.
Enjoyed your Freud piece Robert.
Freud's big problem was that they didn't have disposable diapers in those days, if he had been born in the age of the plastic pamper he wouldn't have had all these unhealthy fixations on such things.
Poor old buggar.
Still, he has a lot of friends around here. |
Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 19
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 12:15 pm: |
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A.P./Robert.Ofcourse finish it off-it would be fun.I favour Druitt Then Cutbush then Kosminski[before he ate out of gutters].The relevant extracts from Ecclesiastes that you quote in Jack the Myth seem far more relevant than Freud to me in this case especially.
I"ve been painting Whitechapel today.Happier in that mode today.[not at work today either].
Loved the bit about the castration complex Robert-you see my subconscious made that connection probably.
Looking forward to your episode[s].
Natalie |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1416
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 12:24 pm: |
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Thanks AP. Well, if Natalie really doesn't want to finish the story, I suppose you will be beefing up Cutbush's part - and sending all the psychoanalysts to hell.
Robert |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1417
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 12:33 pm: |
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Hi Natalie
Just seen your post. Do you really not want to finish it?
I didn't know you were a painter. That must be very interesting.
Robert |
AP Wolf
Chief Inspector
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 597
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 1:16 pm: |
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Stephens and Druitt retired to a corner
With little Jack Horner.
Tom-Tom , David and friend went up the hill
But when they returned there was no sign of Jill.
Vincent and Gaugin compared size of brushes
But in the next room to spare Kate her blushes.
Kate began to decorate her black bonnet with fur
And along came a spider and sat down beside her.
Oscar came in
Sporting a grin
And double gin.
Freud grumbled and moaned
On his mobile phone
‘no pampers?’ he groaned.
The profilers arrived in a group
Each one with two feet in one boot.
Famous authors exchanged thoughts over tea
And each charged other a considerable fee.
The pretenders came in claiming their fame
And each one had a different name.
The lunatic fringe marched through the pack
Declaring it was black magic that we lack.
The….
‘What about me!?’ screamed poor Kate.
‘For I suffered a terrible fate!’
The whole room fell still
But from far away came ringing of till.
One couldn’t hear a sound
As they gathered around.
‘But you are just a women of no import
We know exactly your sort.’
‘But he gutted me!’ she screamed aloud
For a moment startling the crowd.
‘No matter,’ said Steven
‘We just like to get even.’
‘He cut me to bits!’ she implored.
‘Suitable fate for a whore!’
Said Oscar with grin
And ‘nother double gin.
Freud chipped in:
‘He thought you to be his mother
And his father his brother.’
‘And I thought you was a rabbit,’
Said Tom-Tom.
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Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 20
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 1:18 pm: |
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Well I teach part time and the theory is that I"ll paint part time but I seem to have become a bit addicted to the casebook.Still It seems to prompt me into painting mysterious scenes of Whitechapel half rubbed out with turps so thats quite a good byproduct isnt it?Anyway I cant write the wonderful poetry that you and A.P.seem to churn out so effortlessly-my imagination is more visual than literary [and doesnt always function that well visually unless i happen upon some inspiration.Best Natalie
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Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 1419
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 2:35 pm: |
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God arrived and Oscar said "Oh!
One of us has got to go."
All gazed at Oscar, so charismatic -
None knew the picture in his attic.
Nietzsche came in and "The Overman!" cried.
"We're overmanned here!" the others replied,
So Nietzsche went off,
Exceedingly wroth.
Meanwhile, Cohen was getting quite skittish,
Muttering dreadful curses in Yiddish,
Refusing to eat any food
And being generally rude,
But not as rude as that fellow Aaron
Whose palms seemed to have a lot of hair on.
Kate said she needed a drink, and sharp,
And thus the angel pawned her harp.
And while she was absent awhile from there,
Crafty Vincent drew her chair.
Tom went looking for Uncle Charlie,
Found him and had a jolly good parley.
"Uncle," said Tom, "I think 'tis clear
That as below, so up here.
If you're well connected
Then you're respected.
Look at big J yonder hymn-humming :
Didn't he always like to go slumming?"
But then, heaven's sake!
They all took a break.
Natalie, I envy you your artistic abilities. I enjoy pictures, But I couldn't myself paint a decent picture to save my life. It's totally beyond me.
Robert |
Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 21
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 2:50 pm: |
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Well A. P. I haven"t laughed so much as this in a while.The phrase alone"with two feet in one boot"
and the images throughout are riotous!-and the thing is we do all take it seriously and there is more than a kernel of truth in all of it.
From the little we know of Kate she is the one I like the best because her sense of fun shows through -impersonating a fire engine for a start
and then being a bit cheeky with the policeman after being released -her singing softly to herself in her cell is quite touching too especially given the fate awaiting her.She seems to have upset her ex and all their offspring--
and I cant help thinking "Good for her" -there was a bit of the rebel in her I think.And by the accounts the lodging house wardens give she seems to have been very happy with John who wasn"t an alcoholic himself but perhaps understood poor Kate
and accepted her for her "joi de vivre" and resilience and the way she lit up his life. |
Natalie Severn
Sergeant
Username: Severn
Post Number: 22
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 28, 2003 - 3:12 pm: |
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Very enjoyable Robert-clever too.But why pick on dear old Oscar?He said some good things and was witty and brilliant and his De Profundis and THe Ballad of Reading Gaol are among the most remarkable works in the English language.Perhaps he was a misogynist-weren"t all the Victorians?
Natalie. |
