| Author |
Message |
    
Mark Andrew Pardoe
Inspector
Username: Picapica
Post Number: 304
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 11:38 am: | 
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Whatho all,
I have just receive a letter from the Editorial Team of Ripperologist telling me they do not intend publishing their magazine in hard copy form from now. The only edition to be published is electronic.
I am afraid I have no interest in reading a magazine on my computer. I believe in reading magazines in comfort and I do not see why I have to print the damn thing myself.
I do not believe the spin: Ripperologist moves into the 21st Century! but I feel it is a retrograde step ensuring people without computers cannot read the excellent opinions contained within. In fact I feel this move is ridiculous.
It is odd all the other magazines to which I subscribe seem to be happy to use paper.
Cheers, Mark Andrew Pardoe
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Andrew Spallek
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Aspallek
Post Number: 1003
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 2:10 pm: |
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I understand, Mark and I agree with you to a point. On the other hand if the saving they experience on paper, printing, and postage translate to a free or greatly reduced subscription price I'm all for it.
Andy S. |
Suzi Hanney
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Suzi
Post Number: 3345
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 3:57 pm: |
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Hi
I too got the letter today!!!!
Well My first thought is bugger that I can't curl up in bed and read it!!! Come on this can't be a good idea can it???.....won't there be an alternative??
Suzi |
Greg Horan
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 3:29 pm: |
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Well I for one won't be reading the Ripperologist online!
I think we all should be subscribing to the Whitechapel Journal, it's a truely excellent publication - details can be found at http://www.whitechapelsociety.com
and it's only £6 a year!!!!!! |
Stephen P. Ryder
Board Administrator
Username: Admin
Post Number: 3330
Registered: 10-1997
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 4:06 pm: |
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One of the benefits seems to be that Ripperologist will now be monthly, so presumably there will be much more to read and fewer days to wait between feedings.
So there is a silver lining!
And just think of all the trees Adam et al. will be saving... :-)
- Stephen
Stephen P. Ryder, Exec. Editor
Casebook: Jack the Ripper
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Andrew Spallek
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Aspallek
Post Number: 1005
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 4:37 pm: |
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Any news on what the subscription price will be for the online version?
Andy S. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 5345
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 4:57 pm: |
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Andy, it's the same - £24 (and whatever that is in dollars). But as there'll be 12 issues a year, each individual issue will now cost £2 instead of £4.
I hope I've got that right.
Robert |
Jennifer Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 3275
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 5:09 pm: |
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Robert,
i understand that that is correct, ie the price is the same
Jenni
"You know I'm not gonna diss you on the Internet
Cause my mamma taught me better than that."
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AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2921
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 5:21 pm: |
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Could it just be that we view the remains of the first victim of the electronic age here?
That a dinosaur rolls over and plays dead to the new medium by attempting to use that new medium?
That by using the electronic medium we are out-pacing the old vehicles by light years, and everything they intend to publish has already been done and dusted months before they hit the press?
I hope so.
I would like to see a Ripper world without paper books and magazines, without vested and financial interests pulling at hidden strings while puppets jerk in worthless dance to their tune.
I would like to see a Ripper world without clubs, societies, and without conference.
I would like to see a stark world of pure information which is available to everyone at the click of a mouse without all that snobbery, elitism and high-brow buffalo manure.
But then, I’m strange. |
Scott Nelson
Inspector
Username: Snelson
Post Number: 166
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 5:29 pm: |
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Not all that strange in my opinion. |
Howard Brown
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Howard
Post Number: 1222
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 6:05 pm: |
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I agree Scott.
Dear Mark:
You and I and most of the people who subscribe to Ripperologist are pretty avid book readers. I am not sure, but this "move" may be geared towards those who are pretty avid computer readers. I have to admit that I spend more time on line than in front of a book anymore...I think most people "read" on computers than from books anyway..Most people seem to. Maybe its designed for a new target audience..
What I'm hoping is that Mr. Begg and Co. will include previous material from old Ripperologist magazines in some sort of on-line data base. HINT HINT HINT
There could also be a time factor involved as well,Mark. These folks have full time jobs and perhaps the effort in producing the magazine cuts into that time...I don't know. |
David Radka
Detective Sergeant
Username: Dradka
Post Number: 81
Registered: 7-2005
| | Posted on Monday, December 05, 2005 - 7:05 pm: |
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I think Mr. Nelson may be related to U.S. film legend Gary Cooper. Cooper was a man of very few words, often simply "yes" and "no." Occasionally, when playing a more rural role, he'd use "yep" and "nope." This is no criticism of Scott. I think he's sending us an important message. It is that Ripperology says too much about too little content.
David M. Radka
Author: "Alternative Ripperology: Questioning the Whitechapel Murders"
Casebook Dissertations Section
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Andrew Spallek
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Aspallek
Post Number: 1006
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 10:51 am: |
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Thanks, Robert. That's about $50. Too much for me even with 12 issues. Now if the subscription included access to a database of past articles I might reconsider. I was hoping that the printing and mailing saving would translate into a greatly reduced price -- or even free access (with advertising generating the needed revenue).
Andy S. |
David O'Flaherty
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Oberlin
Post Number: 1146
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 12:02 pm: |
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Well, none of the dissertations or press reports on Casebook are in print format. People read those, right? Or book excerpts, online newspapers and magazines. Salon’s totally electronic and has been for years. I read it all the time. So why not read Ripperologist online? That's what going to work is for, reading stuff on the Internet.
On the other hand, double the issues . . . more content for the same money . . . I don’t know, it does seem like a rotten deal. As soon as I pay for my plastic surgery, I am going to have to resubscribe at some point so I can have complaining privileges.
Dave |
Andrew Spallek
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Aspallek
Post Number: 1008
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 12:39 pm: |
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Silly me. Math was never my strong suit. £24 is more like $40. Just want to set the record straight.
Andy S. |
Mark Andrew Pardoe
Inspector
Username: Picapica
Post Number: 305
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 1:34 pm: |
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Whatho all,
I don't care about modern methods. I do not trust the new electronic age. We just don't know how long electronic things last but we've had paper for, what? 500 years.
But there again I'm biased. I was an archivist before I took early retirement.
What really annoys we is there is not choice. We have been presented with a fate-accomplie (can someone please spell that for me?).
Cheers, Mark Andrew Pardoe
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Howard Brown
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Howard
Post Number: 1223
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 1:38 pm: |
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Just in case people forgot about this feature on site:
http://casebook.org/ripper_media/book_reviews/periodicals/ripperologist.search.html |
David O'Flaherty
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Oberlin
Post Number: 1147
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 2:09 pm: |
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Hi Mark,
Let’s talk about the elephant in the room. The main drawback to electronic magazines is that you can’t read ‘em while you’re sitting on the toilet. This is why I predict chamber pots will be coming back in a big way during 2006, because you can lug them around anywhere. Invest now! |
Andrew Spallek
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Aspallek
Post Number: 1009
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 2:30 pm: |
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What really annoys we is there is not choice. We have been presented with a fate-accomplie (can someone please spell that for me?).
No prob, Mark. It's "fâit-accompli"  But in a sense you do have a choice. You can chose to print the articles you wish to read or just read them on the monitor. I know printing adds extra expense. That's why I was hoping for a reduced price.
The main drawback to electronic magazines is that you can’t read ‘em while you’re sitting on the toilet.
Ah, but you can if you have a laptop computer and wireless access. I take it in there all the time. No, I'm not in the loo right now in case you are wondering. 
Andy S. |
George Hutchinson
Chief Inspector
Username: Philip
Post Number: 907
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 2:39 pm: |
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Personally I will not be printing every page out to read it. I read magazines like this whilst on train journeys. I don't spend hours reading things on my PC and I object to the forced obligation to use my printer and ink (which is expensive for my printer) should I wish to read it elsewhere.
I am very disappointed in this and will definitely NOT be renewing my subscription when it runs out should (as will be) the printed version disappears.
May I also ask what security The Rip has taken? Why should anyone else subscribe when the PDF can be copied to everyone on an e-mail list of a single buyer?
For me, this move will simply make The Ripperologist yet another Ripper website - and the only one you have to pay for.
The subscribers should have been consulted.
PHILIP
Tour guides do it loudly in front of a crowd!
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Andrew Spallek
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Aspallek
Post Number: 1010
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 2:52 pm: |
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Philip, I don't argue with you. You have valid points. If the casebook website can be maintained on donations and minimal advertising it would seem that the same could hold true for The Ripperologist. $40 is pretty steep. I'm sure they will lose a lot of subscribers over this.
I would be willing to consider subscribing to the site if a complete database of past issues was available.
Andy S. |
John Malcolm
Sergeant
Username: Johnm
Post Number: 15
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 4:16 pm: |
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Something to think about also, those of us in the States have to shell out $60, which is what I put in the mail only a few weeks ago...this is very disappointing news. |
Suzi Hanney
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Suzi
Post Number: 3347
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 4:35 pm: |
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Dear all
I also will not be renewing here and just on the verge of something that was to be written and illustrated.....Come on chaps!!! WHY?????
Suzi |
Suzi Hanney
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Suzi
Post Number: 3348
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 4:40 pm: |
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Philip-
I can't say how much I agree!!!!!!! I was appalled when I got the letter out of the blue................no consultation is the thing that really got to me..............
This is in danger of making the lovely RIPPEROLOGIST into a Ripperana here!!
Disapointed here!
Suzi |
Andrew Spallek
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Aspallek
Post Number: 1011
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 4:49 pm: |
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If they are still charging $60 to residents of the US that is completely inexcusable. £24 is about $42. I can see adding an extra amount to cover international postage but now that postage is not a factor, Americans should not be charged more than the dollar equivalent of the UK price. Those who have paid a higher price absolutely should get a rebate.
Andy S. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 5350
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 5:12 pm: |
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To be fair to Rip, they do say unlimited pages - and believe me, if they publish our coroners article it'll be just that. 
Robert |
Thomas C. Wescott
Inspector
Username: Tom_wescott
Post Number: 452
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 8:40 pm: |
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POSITIVES: More information received more frequently, and with interactive links. Presumably, the pictures will be clearer and we can adjust the size. The more frequent schedule will allow the news to be more timely and attract authors who want to advertise their books right before and/or after they come out, and not two months before or after.
NEGATIVES: One of the joys of reading is that one can do it in any position or location they desire. I prefer to read in bed on my back but a magazine fits much better in these hands than does a laptop. And let's consider the collectibility. I have a complete set of Ripperologist, beautifully bagged and boarded. In order to maintain this, I will HAVE to print out each issue. Given the cost of paper and printing, this basically means the mag is no cheaper than before and will hold together nowhere near as well than if it came from a professional printers. As a specialist's journal, Rip is by its very nature a collector's journal. This new format in no way takes that into consideration. The 'interactive links to pages, web sites, and e-mails' CANNOT be printed, so that info is lost as soon as the links go dead. It can't be bagged and boarded for future reading. It's just gone. Basically, imagine if the Casebook message boards were edited and proofed. That's what you're getting.
Weighing the pros and cons, I feel this is a huge mistake. I also doubt they considered that I - as a subscriber - could forward MY e-mailed issues onto 5 other people. Why would they then need to subscribe? I'm not saying I would personally do this, but I can guarantee many will.
I subscribed to the quarterly Lizzie Borden journal for one year. It's an online PDF journal and it looks great and many of the articles are good. But I HATE reading long articles on my comp, and my passion for Lizzie not being what it is for Jack, I didn't want to go to the extra expense of printing them. Inevitably, I didn't renew my sub. Would I have renewed if it were a print mag I could read in comfort and collect? Absolutely. In other words, the Lizzie mag (and now Rip) will be stunting their readership. Only hardcore peeps will subscribe. The fringe will go to Ripper Notes. Bottom line.
There's also the contributors to consider. Writers like to see themselves in print. I could write an article and post it on the Casebook or e-mail it to everyone, but that's not as fun as getting printed and KNOWING that the issues you're published in will be collected and read for generations.
I could go on, but I want. It's only speculation on my part, but I think this new '21st Century format' has more to do with funds (or lack thereof) than it does with stepping into the future. I hope they reconsider, because there's nothing like opening your mailbox and seeing that you've received the new issue of a magazine you enjoy. It'll just be another e-mail now. A much longer and more informative e-mail than most I received, granted, but an e-mail nonetheless. Dan Norder must be pissing himself over the news.
Yours truly,
Tom Wescott |
Thomas C. Wescott
Inspector
Username: Tom_wescott
Post Number: 453
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 8:48 pm: |
|
What's Adam Wood going to do now? I guess he'll be 'designing' the subject lines. HA HA HA HA! I crack myself up.
Yours truly,
Tom Wescott |
Thomas C. Wescott
Inspector
Username: Tom_wescott
Post Number: 454
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 8:54 pm: |
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Robert,
You have a long article on coroners? Sounds totally cool. I wonder if any contributors are pulling their articles now that they know they won't actually be 'printed' and preserved?
Yours truly,
Tom Wescott |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 5351
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 4:07 am: |
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Hi Tom
Dave, John and I have a long article - or is that several long articles? - on coroners. I do get a bit confused reading stuff on pdf in particular - the pages seem to jump about.
Robert |
Spiro
Sergeant
Username: Auspirograph
Post Number: 32
Registered: 9-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 5:28 am: |
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R.I.P. print media ??? ... can't be easy to maintain a paper-made periodical today.
Hi Robert,
I apologise for the delay in getting back to you, will return the courtesy soon.
Tom,
Not only are you the only reviewer I know who can actually crack himself up without tools, but also one who actually reviews a magazine's transformational demise. lmao, what the hell are you going to review now?
Cheers
Spiro
Who is looking forward to more news and hopefully some clarifying comments from Ripperologist's editors... |
George Hutchinson
Chief Inspector
Username: Philip
Post Number: 911
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 6:55 am: |
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The Rip... are you listening?
Hello?
He-lloo-ooo?
Nah - nothing. Thought not.
PHILIP
Tour guides do it loudly in front of a crowd!
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Alan Sharp
Chief Inspector
Username: Ash
Post Number: 833
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 7:34 am: |
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Actually I have to agree with Tom here. As contributors to the various magazines do not get paid, I think that when writing articles in the future I am far more likely to give them to Dan Norder or Adrian Morris, in the knowledge that I will then see them in print. If I want to write for an electronic medium then I would want the article to be as widely read as possible, and so would give it to Stephen to put in the dissertations section here where it would be available to everyone rather than to a select few subscribers. It's all very well Rip saying they will be providing more content for the money, but the content has to come from somewhere and if the usual contributors are not providing it, they are not going to have anything to publish.
"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me" - Hunter S. Thompson (1939-2005)
Visit my website - http://www.ashbooks.co.uk/
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Mrs Kelly
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 5:33 pm: |
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Well if all of us subscribers complain i guess they have no choice but start printing it again. Otherwise they will have no subscribers left in 2006. |
Andrew L Morrison
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 7:27 am: |
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"I would like to see a stark world of pure information which is available to everyone at the click of a mouse without all that snobbery,
elitism and high-brow buffalo manure."
There is no such thing as pure information. Also some people know more on some subjects than others - that's not elitism or snobbery that's life! |
A Subscriber
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 6:36 am: |
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Q When is a magazine not a magazine?
A When it's an email attachment.
For the same subscription cost you get an email attachment which you have to print at your own expense (additional cost) and if you look at the cost of color ink cartridges this could be a lot.
You get twice as many email attachments as you would magazines, but so what. Surely the standard of content cannot be maintained over all the extra 'magazines' when they have struggled to keep it up for 6 magazines. The amount of content and quality must suffer.
Will the contributors of articles still be interested in doing their stories for the 'magazine' when they know it will not be published in hard form, will never become a collectable magazine and will eventually disappear into the ether?
I have spoken with five current subscribers who have all told me that they will not be renewing. I guess it is up to the individual but count me out of it. |
AAR
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 9:12 am: |
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It's a pity that DR isn't more like Gary Cooper in my opinion. |
Greg Horan
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 06, 2005 - 12:47 pm: |
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I want to know where the money for subscriptions will be going!
NO printing costs
NO stationary costs
NO postage costs
So how can the price remain the same?
Unless of course someone is lining their pockets and making a business of it.
Lets assume there are 200 subscribers, times that by £24 and what do you get?
THAT'S RIGHT £4,800!
No bad for putting other peoples articles on the web!
Will the contributers be paid?
I think not |
Jennifer Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 3285
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 1:06 pm: |
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Hi everyone,
hello Tom!!
I'd like to think you would at least wait til you've seen it before you judge it.
And that's all I'm saying.
Jenni
"Are you hanging up a stocking on your wall?"
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Jennifer Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 3286
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 1:08 pm: |
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ps Tom,
I don't get your joke at all, its not funny to me, what is it about me that can have gone so wrong for this to have occured.
"Are you hanging up a stocking on your wall?"
|
R.J. Palmer
Chief Inspector
Username: Rjpalmer
Post Number: 771
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 1:13 pm: |
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"POSITIVES: More information received more
frequently."
Sorry, but how is this a positive? History --or at least good history---is a slow process. The field, to my mind, is already too flabby and over-exposed and 'automatic.' Mr. Begg, in an editorial only a year or so ago, said "Ripperology" was running the risk of burning itself out. So now he wants to print a magazine every month? While, meanwhile, there are three other journals, plus the Casebook?
Rushing to publish with the latest fad is never a good thing. I think the 'problem' that Begg is facing is that Stephen's Casebook is getting the 'scoops' as it were, as people put up their private research onto the screen daily, and then the magazines are stuck lagging two months behind of the 'new' developments. Meanwhile, with digitalization, gobs of raw data are emerging. But I'm not convinced this is a 'good' thing, by any stretch of the imagination. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 5354
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 1:18 pm: |
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I think it's unfair to accuse the editors of trying to turn a fast buck.
Robert |
George Hutchinson
Chief Inspector
Username: Philip
Post Number: 913
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 1:54 pm: |
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I've just had an e-mail from Coral Kelly. She says she can't post on Casebook at present for some reason but has asked me to put up this message on her behalf. I thought the e-mail would be explaining why the change is happening, but in fact is in agreement with the vast majority of us :
"Subscribers hand-over their money with the expectation of receiving a hard copy. That makes it a contract. The fact that this is not now happening means that what they are doing is illegal."
PHILIP
Tour guides do it loudly in front of a crowd!
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Andrew Spallek
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Aspallek
Post Number: 1013
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 2:15 pm: |
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So how can the price remain the same?
Unless of course someone is lining their pockets and making a business of it.
Sorry, but I have to ask what's wrong with "making a business of it"? Is there something wrong with turning a profit? Is there a ceiling on profits? Who determines how much profit is too much? I say let the market decide. They are free to ask for any price they want. If they price it too high for the market they will not make a profit.
What does trouble me is those who have already paid for a hard copy subscription. These people deserve to have the balance of their money refunded if they chose not to receive the electronic version.
Andy S. |
AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2927
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 3:17 pm: |
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I would have thought Coral would have been more usefully employed in taking up a brush and sweeping her own house clean before she starts on the property next door. |
Rich
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 3:40 pm: |
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AP Wolf
Can you explain what you mean by your last posting about Coral. As far as I am aware she used to be on the Rip production side but due to something 'political. stuck hard & fast to the Whitechapel Society (aka Clock & Dagger Club) |
Greg Horan
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 3:00 pm: |
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Simple question - what is Mr Begg going to do for the subscribers who are NOT on the net?
I hope he returns their money!
I for one will be subscribing to the Whitechapel Society Journal - a least their letters page is not plagiarised from the Casebook!
CASE CLOSED} as a certain author wrote!!!! |
Rich
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 2:30 pm: |
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I think that what is happening maybe illegal. All subscribers have sent their money knowing that they will receive a hard copy. The money was accepted. As far as I am concerned this is a legally binding contract. They have broken that contract. |
Jennifer Pegg
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Jdpegg
Post Number: 3287
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 4:27 pm: |
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Ap,
what are you on about?
Jenni
"Are you hanging up a stocking on your wall?"
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AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2928
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 07, 2005 - 5:00 pm: |
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Oh, there are good folk out there who know what I am on about. |
