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Message |
    
AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2115
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 24, 2005 - 11:54 am: | 
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This officer was involved in the arrest and detention of Thomas Cutbush, and there has been much speculation - including from myself - about his sudden fall from grace within the Met. Force after this ‘personal triumph’.
It is thought that his promotion from Inspector to Superintendent was blocked for some reason unknown to us, and that he was downgraded and put on a lower salary.
The A-Z says:
‘Shabbily treated by his superiors, who refused him promotion to Superintendent for no good reason, and downgraded him…’
I have always thought this fairly suspicious as well, but I recently came across this passage from WT Stead in the Pall Mall Gazette which I think clearly explains what actually happened:
‘It is the natural ambition of every competent officer to rise to the rank of a superintendent. But when he has distinguished himself in the C. I. D., so that he might fairly claim to be considered for the next vacant superintendency, he is informed that he must go back into uniform and serve at a much lower rate of pay before he can be considered eligible. Promotion to a superintendentship direct from the Criminal Investigation Department is forbidden. But to step from the Inspectorship of the Criminal Investigation Department back into the ranks of the uniformed men involves a loss of salary of nearly £70 per annum. That is the penalty inflicted on a man for being a competent detective. At present there are two officers of the Criminal Investigation Department who have gone back to uniform in the hope of becoming superintendents. It has entailed upon each a sacrifice of that sum per annum.’
So I think we should stop feeling sorry for Inspector Race. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4452
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 24, 2005 - 2:38 pm: |
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Hi AP
That's interesting. So Race had to go back to a lower salary in order to put in for Superintendent? But then, not getting the job, he was kept at the lower salary? Is that what happened?
Robert |
AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2118
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 24, 2005 - 5:17 pm: |
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That's about it, Robert.
He might just as well have taken a seat at the kitchen table and blown his head off. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4453
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 24, 2005 - 5:26 pm: |
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That seems very unfair, I must say, AP. More like a lottery.
Robert |
AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2119
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 24, 2005 - 5:49 pm: |
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If he drunk enough brandy he might have missed.
That's why I'm still alive. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4454
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 24, 2005 - 6:03 pm: |
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Well I spend so much money on tea, I can't afford the gun.
Robert |
AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2120
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 25, 2005 - 5:18 pm: |
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You could always try 'Gunpowder Green tea' Robert.
A fine brew for the kitchen table.
I had not realised that our good Inspector Race was also involved in the Thomas Neill affair of 1892. That is Dr.Cream to you and me.
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AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2294
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 5:59 pm: |
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Following up on the sudden demise of Inspector Race, one must say that it does appear as if he had broken some kind of rule of conduct within the Met. Force as he was subject to disciplinary action in 1895 while actually working in the CO’s department at Scotland Yard; and then again in 1897 when he was actually demoted to a sergeant’s position in Whitechapel.
I do feel that it may well have been Inspector Race who provided the ‘Sun’ with the material concerning Thomas Cutbush.
It is also interesting to note that Inspectors’ Race, Chisholm and Cutbush all shared time together at Lambeth (Kennington) police station and then at the CO’s department at Scotland Yard.
It was of course Race and Chisholm who investigated Thomas Cutbush in 1891, when they shared an office with uncle Charles.
Keep it neat and sweet is still the motto of the Met.
Thanks, Robert, for the police orders site. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4681
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 4:37 am: |
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AP, some time ago I'm sure I saw an item in the "Times" where PS McCarthy was accused of bribery, corruption or some such. He was cleared.
I tried to find it again the other day but without success.
Robert |
John Ruffels
Inspector
Username: Johnr
Post Number: 401
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 6:33 am: |
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Robert,
Strangely, P S McCarthy's bribery accusation does not seem to have made it into the Police Index, on the Black Sheep Index site.
Although "Supt Macarthy, Metro Scot Yd: Retirement: 1918" does.
Also listed are:" Sgt. Race: Metro W: Dinner: 1886 "; D.I. Race: Metro L: Evidence of: 1889"; Insp Race: Metro H: Capture By:1896"; and " Insp W N Race: Metro L/W: Biog & Photo: 1898".
and: " Supt Chisholm: Metro Thames: Marriage of daughter:1899 ".
No doubt, A P Wolf has snaffled these tidbits up
already. |
John Ruffels
Inspector
Username: Johnr
Post Number: 402
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 6:45 am: |
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By the way, A P,
I notice in the Cutbush Memorandum, Melville Macnaghten scathingly chides Insp. Race for commandeering a knife, instead of handing it in to the officer in charge of Prisoner's Property.
THE SUN rather incautiously says the knife is in the possession of the informant for the article.
Perhaps that was the give-away which enabled Macnaghten to sheet home the blame for the Cutbush leak to Race. Perhaps allowing Macnaghten to trump up mild charges to blight Race's future career.
Macnaghten's jibe about the knife is monumentally hypocritical in view of Macnaghten's own desk draw containing gruesome photos of actual murdered corpses. Doubtless these were Police Property too.
His descendants also testify to Macnaghten having the ORIGINAL of the Red Ink Ripper letter/ card
hanging on the wall of his house: "Copy be damned!
That's the original", his grandson boasted to a friend. (Source: Farson). |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4682
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 1:35 pm: |
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Thanks for that, John. Race seems to have copped some hassle - in fact he was almost a Race apart.
Robert |
AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2295
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 6:12 pm: |
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You’ll have to forgive me chaps, but I’m under enormous pressure here at the moment and rarely have time to post.
John’s point about the knife is so good that I dearly wish I had the gumption to find that before him.
Yes, Robert, I have that reference too, somewhere, you say ‘cleared’, that is polite… if I remember the fracas correctly he was caught bang to rights. I’ll see if I can’t find it.
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Jeffrey Bloomfied
Chief Inspector
Username: Mayerling
Post Number: 748
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 7:57 pm: |
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Hi A.P.
I had not known that this Inspector Race was involved chasing Doctor Cream. Where did you come across that?
Best wishes,
Jeff |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4683
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 8:49 pm: |
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Hi Jeff
I don't know whether this is what AP meant, but Race was mentioned in the "Times" trial report Oct 19th 1892 as preparing a plan of the district.
Robert |
Jeffrey Bloomfied
Chief Inspector
Username: Mayerling
Post Number: 750
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 15, 2005 - 8:03 pm: |
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Hi Robert
Well, I suppose it was necessary because of the length of time and number of attacks involved to follow Cream's five set of movements (don't forget, he was also charged with the attempted poisoning of Lou Harvey).
I wonder if anybody ever tracked down Ms Harvey - the only one of the prostitutes who was smart enough not to swallow Cream's generous "medicine". I wonder when she finally died.
Jeff |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4684
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 5:33 am: |
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Hi Jeff
It might take a while to track down the lady known as Lou!
Robert |
AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2298
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 6:02 pm: |
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Robert
I failed to find the McCarthy reference, but I will, but I also found that Kennington murder again, where McCarthy appears to run two different men through the same Lambeth court for the same murder and he has a confession out of the pair of 'em.
Maybe I read it wrong.
'Kennington Murder. March 18th 1899.'
Anyways I'll get him.
Interesting that all the coppers involved did the Lambeth Walk though.
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AP Wolf
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Apwolf
Post Number: 2299
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 6:18 pm: |
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Robert
I think I might have just remembered.
He was taking bets on horses whilst in uniform on a train, and using the new telegraph system at stations to further his own financial interest.
He knew the results before he took the bets.
I think that was it.
Classic. |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4686
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 7:05 pm: |
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AP, I read the Kennington thing as being about one and the same man.
So McCarthy was tossing a double-headed horse?
PS Mr Phil on Cutbush 1881 thread wants to know if you know Kate's mother's maiden name.
Robert |
Jeffrey Bloomfied
Chief Inspector
Username: Mayerling
Post Number: 751
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 9:58 pm: |
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Hi Robert,
Given that the trial and execution of Cream is in 1892, and the Yukon - Alaskan gold rush was in 1897 to 1898, Lou might have met Dan up in the Klondike. Maybe she met Robert Service too.
Best wishes,
Jeff |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4688
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 5:33 am: |
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Hi Jeff
I love that poem.
I've an idea they used one of Service's poems in a film whose title I can't recall. I know that it starred Donald Pleasance, and the plot concerned sleepers, people who have been hypnotised and are then triggered to go into action on receipt of a trigger. In this case, the trigger was Donald Pleasance phoning them and reciting some lines from Service's poetry.
Robert |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4689
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 7:37 am: |
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Jeff, found it. The film was "Telefon."
Robert |
Jeffrey Bloomfied
Chief Inspector
Username: Mayerling
Post Number: 752
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 2:17 pm: |
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Hi Robert,
I haven't seen TELEFON. On the other hand, THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE had a similar gimmick, with people triggered by the words "Miles to go before I sleep" (and in the original Laurence Harvey played solitaire).
Service is a popular poet, but I find that few people read more than one or two of his poems. He's also one of the few poets whose work always seems to be in print.
I looked in my copy of Angus McLaren's A PRESCIPTION FOR MURDER about Cream for any comments regarding Detective Race, but there was none listed in the index. Of course, he might be hidden in a footnote.
Best wishes,
Jeff |
Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4690
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 3:29 pm: |
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Jeff, those lines you quoted - I thought they, or something very similar, were the trigger in "Telefon"!
Have they used the same trigger in two films, or have I got it wrong?
Robert |
Jeffrey Bloomfied
Chief Inspector
Username: Mayerling
Post Number: 753
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 9:19 pm: |
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Hi Robert,
A friend of mine recently told me that in THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE the final line from Robert Frost's poem, "And miles to go before I sleep" is used to trigger. I can't recall it from the original Angela Lansbury MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE, but if may be from the recent one with Meryl Streep.
At least it is a classier trigger than the one used by Robert Redford in THE HOT ROCK: "Afghanistan Bananastan".
Jeff
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Robert Charles Linford
Assistant Commissioner
Username: Robert
Post Number: 4698
Registered: 3-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 3:22 am: |
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Hi Jeff
It sounds to me like I got it wrong, and the trigger I had in mind wasn't by Service, but by Frost.
"Afghanistan Bananastan" was obviously Shakespeare!
Robert |
Andrew L Morrison
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 9:01 am: |
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The lines from Telefon are from the Robert Frost poem "Stopping by Woods on a Snowy Evening"
"The woods are lovely, dark, and deep,
But I've got promises to keep
And miles to go before I sleep,
And miles to go before I sleep."
Andrew |
