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Tiddley boyar
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Saturday, December 13, 2003 - 5:26 am: |       |
Hi all, I'm trying to find any references on the name G. Wentworth Bell Smith whom I believe figured in name in one of the number of lodger stories. I seem to remember the name possibly from the account in 1889 by Forbes Winslow? Any help or pointers for a source would be greatly appreciated. Cheers. Carl |
Max Flude
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 10, 2004 - 9:00 pm: | |
He was Canadian, and I hope for my country's sake it wasn't him. Imagine, the Ripper Jack was a Canadian!
Go to google or aol or yahoo, type in "the lodger" and there will be some sites to read, and you can determine if he was a plausible suspect. |
Tiddley boyar
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 - 9:55 am: | |
Cheers Max, I managed to find the necessary info on Casebook. Don't worry about the Canadian connection, he was an Englishman using a made up name as I suspected. Regards, Tiddley |
Chris Scott
Chief Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 887
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 - 7:20 pm: | |
Hi Tiddley
I wouldn't be too quick to dismiss the name as being made up. I have long suspected that the name has been misreported and that the person in question was G. Wentworth Bellsmith. In the 1881 UK census there is not one recorded occurrence of the surname Bellsmith, likewise in the 1880 USA census. Howeever, there are 11 people (consisting of two households) in the Canadian 1881 census, all living in Ontario. One of these families lived in a place called Wentworth, and the other family had a member called Wentworth Bellsmith! All but one of these people are listed as born in England.
1)
Address:
Ward 2, Hamilton, Wentworth, Ontario
John Bellsmith aged 70 - Artist
Georgeina Bellsmith aged 61
Louis C Bellsmith aged 22 - Student
Gertrude Bellsmith aged 18
Florance Bellsmith aged 16
All are listed as born in England
2)
Address:
Collingwood, Simcoe North, Ontario
Henry Bellsmith aged 31 - Book keeper
Susannah Bellsmith aged 35
Eustace Bellsmith aged 8
Evanjeline Bellsmith aged 6
Fred Bellsmith aged 4
Wentworth Bellsmith aged 2
All listed as born in England except Wentworth who was born in Ontario.
Hope this gives some food for thought - any other info I will post here
Chris |
Chris Scott
Chief Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 888
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 - 7:47 pm: | |
Hi Tiddley
Just a further thought - have a look at one branch of the Bellsmith family tree at
http://www.bellsmith.com/famtree.htm
and notice how many times the unusual forename Wentworth occurs with the even rarer surname Bellsmith.
I find this intriguing - looks like some sort of family tradition.
Chris
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Chris Scott
Chief Inspector
Username: Chris
Post Number: 889
Registered: 4-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 11, 2004 - 8:18 pm: | |
Of the family line mentioned above, the most interesting datewise is H. Wentworth Bellsmith about whom I have managed to find some more details as below:
Henry Wentworth Bellsmith. Born Sep 1849 England. Died 1926 New York. He was the son of John
Bell-Smith and Georgina Maria Boddy.
He married Susanna Anne. Born England. Died 1922 Toronto, Ontario, Canada. Children of Henry
Wentworth Bellsmith and Susanna Anne are:
1. Eustace John Bellsmith. Born 23 Mar 1873 Penge, London, England.
2. Wentworth Marlett Bellsmith.
3. Evangeline Mary Bellsmith. Born May 1875 .
He married Caroline Taylor. Born Sep 1866 England. Children of Henry Wentworth Bellsmith and
Caroline Taylor are:
1. Francis Taylor Bellsmith. Born Nov 1890 .
2. Henry Wentworth Jr. Bellsmith. Born 30 Apr 1894 Brooklyn, NY. Died Jul 1965 .
3. Todd Bellsmith.
Henry and Susanna separated in 1888. Henry W. married Caroline in 1889
or 1890 before moving to NY in 1891.
This info is from a Gedcom file on the genealogy.com website
Chris
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David Knott
Sergeant
Username: Dknott
Post Number: 40
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 31, 2004 - 5:24 am: | |
Hi all,
I have been in touch with Mike Bellsmith who was responsible for the genealogical work referred to by Chris and he has given me some very interesting information.
The original 'Bell-Smith' was John Bell-Smith (1810-1883). He was an artist and was actually born John Smith. As there were many artists by that name, he changed his name to Bell-Smith in honour of a friend named Bell. It seems that all the Bell-Smiths and Bellsmiths can be traced back to John.
John was married in 1845, and had twelve children, eight of which were sons. In the 1860s much of the family moved from England to Toronto.
Mike confirms that Wentworth is indeed a family name. Given this, and the fact that the surname just didn't exist prior to John Bell-Smith, it would seem that G Wentworth Bell Smith must have been the Henry Wentworth Bellsmith mentioned by Chris. None of the other sons fit the bill, and Henry is known to have come to London from Toronto at the right time. A final bit of confirmation that G was in fact Henry (Mike's great grandfather) comes form the description "he walked with his feet wide apart" ... Mike actually recognises this as a family trait, which only affects direct descendants of Henry!
I have been given some other avenues of research and will let you know what I can find, although I note that R J Palmer has posted that Henry was aboard a steamship to New York at the time of the Kelly murder.
David |
David Knott
Sergeant
Username: Dknott
Post Number: 41
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 6:12 am: | |
Regarding the article posted on the thread Suspects:The Lodger:Letter From Albert Backert, if I am correct in assuming that Mr Callaghan's G Wentworth Bell Smith was in fact H Wentworth Bellsmith then it would seem that the article does not refer to him as it mentions his father (who died in 1883) and an older brother who was a doctor - Henry's oldest brother was only three years his senior and was a famous painter - Frederic Marlett Bellsmith. However, there are so many parts of the article that exactly match Callaghan's story that I am inclined to think it is fiction.
H Wentworth Bellsmith also had another famous sibling, Florence Rosalind Bellsmith, who went on to marry Jonathan Goforth, the missionary. She wrote a number of books about their work (under the name Rosalind Goforth) some of which are available online. 'CLIMBING' includes some childhood memories. The familys religious upbringing might also tie in with Callaghan's lodger's religious outpourings. |
Nancy Emde Bell-Smith
Unregistered guest
| | Posted on Friday, October 29, 2004 - 11:50 am: | |
I am wanting to find out who did the research and posting of the Decendants of John Bell-Smith website. I could give further names and dates including my own family which has been missed entirely. Clifford Marlett Bell-Smith + Mable Pearl Webb had 4 children, Robert Marlett 1943, Clifford John 1945, Mable Rosanne 1948 and Nancy Darlene 1953(me). I am married to Robert Mark Emde and have three children, Matthew Ryan 1978 + Eleisa Schmeichel m. 2001, Graham Michael 1980, Rosalind Carrie(1983)+ Brendon Fredlund m. 2004 |
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